Ultimate Liquid Wax. Worth it? Does it protect? Which Chemical Coating is best? Why?

[Dizzy Chemist]

Hi,
Newb here Dizzy from all the marketing found online.

Just got a new Civic. Bought it, didn't lease. The previous civic we had was a lease, so I think I washed it twice in 4 years. Noticed tiny rust spots that came out on it when we gave it back after the lease.

So, now that we bought, I think we shoud start to take better care of it than we did with the leased one

So after reading up on the various car waxes and sealants, I decided sealant (polymer) is the way to go. In addition to this, the marketing behind various products was enough to make this chemist dizzy, thus the name. It really does take you for a loop. A big one. Lots of myths (bordering fantasy) out there in both product claims and write-ups of various products by various websites.

...and who knows, I may end up finding this to be a new hobby.

So I have a few newb questions to toss at the forum. Looking for honest answers minus the marketing buzz words and fairytails. And, well, maybe someone can convince me to (being honest here) pay more for certain products.

Down to business.

The one thing that caught my eye was the 2011 Consumer Reports article on their tests of wax and sealants. Press release here:

http://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/products-from-meguiar-and-nu-finish-top-consumer-reports-ratings-of-liquid-and-paste-car-waxes-129032603.html

I was actually going to buy the NFP-80 paste (will use the product number instead of the product name incase that offends someone). But after more digging I found that this might not be for me. More to do with the potential trim staining problem on a new car. Otherwise I wouldn't hesiste to get this one.

I Then looked in the the other highly rated Consumer Reports product, Meguiar's Nxt Generation Tech Wax 2.0. 4x the price, but, per this forum (at least in one post I found), it seems it good for only 2 months max. I honestly find that pretty low with todays polymer science. But what do I know.

Then I noticed the meguiars advisor website http://www.meguiars.com/en/product-advisor/ it
stated to use the Ultimate Liquid Wax (5x the price) for a new car, and that it's better than the Nxt Generation Tech Wax 2.0 in terms of protection and durability (how long it lasts).

Questions:
1. Was the Ultimate Liquid Wax used in the consumers report teststing?
If so, why didn't it meet or exceed Nxt Generation Tech Wax 2.0? Or, is this product new as of the past year?

2. Should more than one application be made after the initial cure time of the first coat?

3. What is the life of this product once applied with one or two coats (asume a Montreal winter where road salt in excess is the norm). Will an application (or two) last 6 months? 3 months? Or does it degrade after an average of one or two months? What are the lab tests for this, if any? Or, real world experience from people here? I prefer hard results, but I guess opinion works as well if none is to be had.

Silicones and the polymers.

Now being a chemist and having worked metal finishing for areospace and miltary, I can tell you the horror stories of military inspectors coming in due to fisheye on a product due to some type of silicon (or other) contamination (which they asked for BTW). But I have no real-world experience in cars.

However, After looking at everything it seems it's impossible to get away from silicones with the shelf products available for consumers. I haven't looked into the Ultimate liquid Wax product, but everything to date shows there is silicon in everything (even when you think it doesn't have it, it's there).

Question (maybe one for the people who do paint touch-ups here):
1. Will there be issues if ever a paint touch-up needs to be done and I end up using the Ultimate Liquid Wax product?

2. I believe the polish step (after washing) is to remove previous chemical coatings. So the silicones hit the bare paint? Again, isn't this an issue?

3. The clear coat bonding polymer. What type of polymer is the Ultimate liquid Wax? Hydrocarbon? Silicone? Other?

The car goes in for rust proofing (Krown) tomorrow. The Rust Proofer recommends waiting 3 weeks before I put any type of coating on it, which make sense. So I have a bit of time for people to recommend stuff and, I guess, convince me.

If there are any meguiars employees around this forum (or lab rats are even better), and they have some spec/tech sheets on anything (even salt spray results, if any exists, or other), I wouldn't mind looking at it. Let's face it, It's not cheap stuff. But, is it good enough to satisfy this dizzy chemist with the marketing hype removed and at 5x the cost?

Feel free to drop links to other forum topics if all this has been asked/answered before.

Guess i'll have some trim questions later on as well. And clay questions, are they all created equal? Clay is clay, right?

TY!

[benzw205]

Re: Ultimate Liquid Wax. Worth it? Does it protect? Which Chemical Coating is best? W

Hi,
Newb here Dizzy from all the marketing found online.

Just got a new Civic. Bought it, didn't lease. The previous civic we had was a lease, so I think I washed it twice in 4 years. Noticed tiny rust spots that came out on it when we gave it back after the lease.

So, now that we bought, I think we shoud start to take better care of it than we did with the leased one

So after reading up on the various car waxes and sealants, I decided sealant (polymer) is the way to go. In addition to this, the marketing behind various products was enough to make this chemist dizzy, thus the name. It really does take you for a loop. A big one. Lots of myths (bordering fantasy) out there in both product claims and write-ups of various products by various websites.

...and who knows, I may end up finding this to be a new hobby.

So I have a few newb questions to toss at the forum. Looking for honest answers minus the marketing buzz words and fairytails. And, well, maybe someone can convince me to (being honest here) pay more for certain products.

Down to business.

The one thing that caught my eye was the 2011 Consumer Reports article on their tests of wax and sealants. Press release here:

http://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/products-from-meguiar-and-nu-finish-top-consumer-reports-ratings-of-liquid-and-paste-car-waxes-129032603.html

I was actually going to buy the NFP-80 paste (will use the product number instead of the product name incase that offends someone). But after more digging I found that this might not be for me. More to do with the potential trim staining problem on a new car. Otherwise I wouldn't hesiste to get this one.

I Then looked in the the other highly rated Consumer Reports product, Meguiar's Nxt Generation Tech Wax 2.0. 4x the price, but, per this forum (at least in one post I found), it seems it good for only 2 months max. I honestly find that pretty low with todays polymer science. But what do I know.

Then I noticed the meguiars advisor website http://www.meguiars.com/en/product-advisor/ it
stated to use the Ultimate Liquid Wax (5x the price) for a new car, and that it's better than the Nxt Generation Tech Wax 2.0 in terms of protection and durability (how long it lasts).

Questions:
1. Was the Ultimate Liquid Wax used in the consumers report teststing?
If so, why didn't it meet or exceed Nxt Generation Tech Wax 2.0? Or, is this product new as of the past year?

2. Should more than one application be made after the initial cure time of the first coat?

3. What is the life of this product once applied with one or two coats (asume a Montreal winter where road salt in excess is the norm). Will an application (or two) last 6 months? 3 months? Or does it degrade after an average of one or two months? What are the lab tests for this, if any? Or, real world experience from people here? I prefer hard results, but I guess opinion works as well if none is to be had.

Silicones and the polymers.

Now being a chemist and having worked metal finishing for areospace and miltary, I can tell you the horror stories of military inspectors coming in due to fisheye on a product due to some type of silicon (or other) contamination (which they asked for BTW). But I have no real-world experience in cars.

However, After looking at everything it seems it's impossible to get away from silicones with the shelf products available for consumers. I haven't looked into the Ultimate liquid Wax product, but everything to date shows there is silicon in everything (even when you think it doesn't have it, it's there).

Question (maybe one for the people who do paint touch-ups here):
1. Will there be issues if ever a paint touch-up needs to be done and I end up using the Ultimate Liquid Wax product?

2. I believe the polish step (after washing) is to remove previous chemical coatings. So the silicones hit the bare paint? Again, isn't this an issue?

3. The clear coat bonding polymer. What type of polymer is the Ultimate liquid Wax? Hydrocarbon? Silicone? Other?

The car goes in for rust proofing (Krown) tomorrow. The Rust Proofer recommends waiting 3 weeks before I put any type of coating on it, which make sense. So I have a bit of time for people to recommend stuff and, I guess, convince me.

If there are any meguiars employees around this forum (or lab rats are even better), and they have some spec/tech sheets on anything (even salt spray results, if any exists, or other), I wouldn't mind looking at it. Let's face it, It's not cheap stuff. But, is it good enough to satisfy this dizzy chemist with the marketing hype removed and at 5x the cost?

Feel free to drop links to other forum topics if all this has been asked/answered before.

Guess i'll have some trim questions later on as well. And clay questions, are they all created equal? Clay is clay, right?

TY!

Hello, do you know if I can use this on a car that has ceramic coating ?

Thanks.

[Blueline]

Re: Ultimate Liquid Wax. Worth it? Does it protect? Which Chemical Coating is best? W

Hi,
Newb here Dizzy from all the marketing found online.

I am no chemist, but I did stay at a Holiday Inn once. Most of your questions are unanswerable, as there will be more opinions on wax, than Carter has pills. A lot is hype, personal perception/preference, misconceptions, and some will simply be blind brand loyalty. Generally the more expensive waxes will last longer, and it is not because wax cannot last even longer, but longer lasting waxes means less product moving, so companies with the longer lasting waxes, charge more, and the less durable waxes, are less expensive, but they move more product. I cannot answer all of your questions individually, however I am sure you will get some very detailed replies, answering every one of your questions.

In my case, my preference was M16, however it is not made anymore, so I use Ultimate Past Wax. Never a fan of any liquid wax, however the ULW probably performs the same as UPW. I do only two full details a year, spring and fall, and reside in a similar climate as Montreal (winter, salty roads) and the UPW seems to certainly last through the winter. One thing I never do in the winter is wash my car, so while it is covered in salt, I am not washing the wax off. Washing just reactivates the corrosion properties of the dried salt and water pressure just drives in into the crevices. Also while my vehicles are daily drivers, they are garaged, and rarely sit in the sun. I am sure waxing does provide some protection, however having it rust proofed by Krown (I prefer Rust check) is the best thing you can do for your vehicle. One of my cars is twelve years old, and has been rust proofed every year. Underneath looks almost new, albeit it greasy and dirty, and the body sparkles due to a semi annual clay, polish, and waxing. All I can say, is don't over think this. It is definitely not rocket (or chemical) science. Well maybe some chemical science. Pick a product you like, based on whatever information you have, and try it. Most of the reasonably priced brands do about the same job, and depth of glossiness, is only in the eye of the beholder. I like the UPW as it is easy to apply, easy off, seems to offer some protection, looks great on my black cars, and seems to last. Basic paint maintenance - clay, polish if needed, and wax - and you should be good to go, and still have time to do other things with the new car YOU own. Alternatively, you can spend your time detailing, driving yourself nuts for that perfect product and shine, have no time for other things in life, and then the car owns YOU.

[jfelbab]

Re: Ultimate Liquid Wax. Worth it? Does it protect? Which Chemical Coating is best? W

I’ll add my experience/opinions here to answer your questions where I can.


Hi,
Newb here Dizzy from all the marketing found online.


Just got a new Civic. Bought it, didn't lease. The previous civic we had was a lease, so I think I washed it twice in 4 years. Noticed tiny rust spots that came out on it when we gave it back after the lease.


So, now that we bought, I think we shoud start to take better care of it than we did with the leased one


So after reading up on the various car waxes and sealants, I decided sealant (polymer) is the way to go. In addition to this, the marketing behind various products was enough to make this chemist dizzy, thus the name. It really does take you for a loop. A big one. Lots of myths (bordering fantasy) out there in both product claims and write-ups of various products by various websites.


I settled on a sealant instead of a wax or a coating for my personal vehicles. I did so for various reasons but mostly because I like the appearance and durability of a sealant. The ability to apply ULW in full sun and the fact that it doesn’t stain trim makes the application process much faster. I use the ULW/UQW for my trim protectant these days too.


...and who knows, I may end up finding this to be a new hobby.


So I have a few newb questions to toss at the forum. Looking for honest answers minus the marketing buzz words and fairytails. And, well, maybe someone can convince me to (being honest here) pay more for certain products.


Down to business.


The one thing that caught my eye was the 2011 Consumer Reports article on their tests of wax and sealants. Press release here:
http://www.prnewswire.com/news-relea...129032603.html


2011 is 6 years ago and products come and go, change and improve relatively quickly over this time so I’d not put much faith in that old report.


I was actually going to buy the NFP-80 paste (will use the product number instead of the product name incase that offends someone). But after more digging I found that this might not be for me. More to do with the potential trim staining problem on a new car. Otherwise I wouldn't hesiste to get this one.


I Then looked in the the other highly rated Consumer Reports product, Meguiar's Nxt Generation Tech Wax 2.0. 4x the price, but, per this forum (at least in one post I found), it seems it good for only 2 months max. I honestly find that pretty low with todays polymer science. But what do I know.


Then I noticed the meguiars advisor website http://www.meguiars.com/en/product-advisor/ it
stated to use the Ultimate Liquid Wax (5x the price) for a new car, and that it's better than the Nxt Generation Tech Wax 2.0 in terms of protection and durability (how long it lasts).


Questions:
1. Was the Ultimate Liquid Wax used in the consumers report teststing?
If so, why didn't it meet or exceed Nxt Generation Tech Wax 2.0? Or, is this product new as of the past year?


I don’t believe it was part of that test as it may have not been available back in 2011. I can’t recall exactly how long I’ve been using ULW but it’s been at least since 2012. I think it was introduced in 2012 but Megs can answer that. There are hundreds of automotive protection products available in the consumer market and CR couldn’t possibly test every product.


2. Should more than one application be made after the initial cure time of the first coat?


Not necessary, but a second application may insure complete coverage. My belief is that the ULW product will not layer. I only use one application and it’s true that the product does not stain trim.


3. What is the life of this product once applied with one or two coats (asume a Montreal winter where road salt in excess is the norm). Will an application (or two) last 6 months? 3 months? Or does it degrade after an average of one or two months? What are the lab tests for this, if any? Or, real world experience from people here? I prefer hard results, but I guess opinion works as well if none is to be had.


I used to live in Wisconsin where bitter winters were the norm and a challenge for any protection product. ULW would easily last the winter. I have a habit of using Ultimate Quik Wax (D156) after every wash to maintain and boost my ULW sealant to unsure a slick surface and protection. This is a wipe-on, wipe-off product that applies like a QD so it only adds 10-15 minutes to the wash time. UQW also does not stain trim and like ULW, is also a sealant rather than a wax.


Silicones and the polymers.


Now being a chemist and having worked metal finishing for areospace and miltary, I can tell you the horror stories of military inspectors coming in due to fisheye on a product due to some type of silicon (or other) contamination (which they asked for BTW). But I have no real-world experience in cars.


However, After looking at everything it seems it's impossible to get away from silicones with the shelf products available for consumers. I haven't looked into the Ultimate liquid Wax product, but everything to date shows there is silicon in everything (even when you think it doesn't have it, it's there).


Question (maybe one for the people who do paint touch-ups here):
1. Will there be issues if ever a paint touch-up needs to be done and I end up using the Ultimate Liquid Wax product?


Whether a product you use contains silicone would not be an issue for a quality paint shop as they will decontaminate the surface to be painted to remove any trace of silicone prior to painting. It has not been an issue for touch-up of small rock chips IME.


2. I believe the polish step (after washing) is to remove previous chemical coatings. So the silicones hit the bare paint? Again, isn't this an issue?


The polishing step will remove prior coatings along with swirls and light paint marring. Again, silicone would not be an issue for a quality paint shop as they would also decontaminate the paint prior to spraying.


3. The clear coat bonding polymer. What type of polymer is the Ultimate liquid Wax? Hydrocarbon? Silicone? Other?


The car goes in for rust proofing (Krown) tomorrow. The Rust Proofer recommends waiting 3 weeks before I put any type of coating on it, which make sense. So I have a bit of time for people to recommend stuff and, I guess, convince me.


If there are any meguiars employees around this forum (or lab rats are even better), and they have some spec/tech sheets on anything (even salt spray results, if any exists, or other), I wouldn't mind looking at it. Let's face it, It's not cheap stuff. But, is it good enough to satisfy this dizzy chemist with the marketing hype removed and at 5x the cost?


Feel free to drop links to other forum topics if all this has been asked/answered before.


Guess i'll have some trim questions later on as well. And clay questions, are they all created equal? Clay is clay, right?


As I previously alluded. I also use ULW + UQW for my exterior trim protection. It leaves a nice uniform patina and long lasting protection.


RE: clay... There are different grades of clay. Some is more abrasive than others. With a new vehicle, you should be fine with a mild clay which is what you get in consumer products from local auto stores. Read about the "baggie test: to determine if/when you need to use clay.


TY!

[Lewalaust]

Re: Ultimate Liquid Wax. Worth it? Does it protect? Which Chemical Coating is best? W

Hi,
Newb here Dizzy from all the marketing found online.

Just got a new Civic. Bought it, didn't lease. The previous civic we had was a lease, so I think I washed it twice in 4 years. Noticed tiny rust spots that came out on it when we gave it back after the lease.

So, now that we bought, I think we shoud start to take better care of it than we did with the leased one

So after reading up on the various car waxes and sealants, I decided sealant (polymer) is the way to go. In addition to this, the marketing behind various products was enough to make this chemist dizzy, thus the name. It really does take you for a loop. A big one. Lots of myths (bordering fantasy) out there in both product claims and write-ups of various products by various websites.

...and who knows, I may end up finding this to be a new hobby.

So I have a few newb questions to toss at the forum. Looking for honest answers minus the marketing buzz words and fairytails. And, well, maybe someone can convince me to (being honest here) pay more for certain products.

Down to business.

The one thing that caught my eye was the 2011 Consumer Reports article on their tests of wax and sealants. Press release here:

http://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/products-from-meguiar-and-nu-finish-top-consumer-reports-ratings-of-liquid-and-paste-car-waxes-129032603.html

I was actually going to buy the NFP-80 paste (will use the product number instead of the product name incase that offends someone). But after more digging I found that this might not be for me. More to do with the potential trim staining problem on a new car. Otherwise I wouldn't hesiste to get this one.

I Then looked in the the other highly rated Consumer Reports product, Meguiar's Nxt Generation Tech Wax 2.0. 4x the price, but, per this forum (at least in one post I found), it seems it good for only 2 months max. I honestly find that pretty low with todays polymer science. But what do I know.

Then I noticed the meguiars advisor website http://www.meguiars.com/en/product-advisor/ it
stated to use the Ultimate Liquid Wax (5x the price) for a new car, and that it's better than the Nxt Generation Tech Wax 2.0 in terms of protection and durability (how long it lasts).

Questions:
1. Was the Ultimate Liquid Wax used in the consumers report teststing?
If so, why didn't it meet or exceed Nxt Generation Tech Wax 2.0? Or, is this product new as of the past year?

2. Should more than one application be made after the initial cure time of the first coat?

3. What is the life of this product once applied with one or two coats (asume a Montreal winter where road salt in excess is the norm). Will an application (or two) last 6 months? 3 months? Or does it degrade after an average of one or two months? What are the lab tests for this, if any? Or, real world experience from people here? I prefer hard results, but I guess opinion works as well if none is to be had.

Silicones and the polymers.

Now being a chemist and having worked metal finishing for areospace and miltary, I can tell you the horror stories of military inspectors coming in due to fisheye on a product due to some type of silicon (or other) contamination (which they asked for BTW). But I have no real-world experience in cars.

However, After looking at everything it seems it's impossible to get away from silicones with the shelf products available for consumers. I haven't looked into the Ultimate liquid Wax product, but everything to date shows there is silicon in everything (even when you think it doesn't have it, it's there).

Question (maybe one for the people who do paint touch-ups here):
1. Will there be issues if ever a paint touch-up needs to be done and I end up using the Ultimate Liquid Wax product?

2. I believe the polish step (after washing) is to remove previous chemical coatings. So the silicones hit the bare paint? Again, isn't this an issue?

3. The clear coat bonding polymer. What type of polymer is the Ultimate liquid Wax? Hydrocarbon? Silicone? Other?

The car goes in for rust proofing (Krown) tomorrow. The Rust Proofer recommends waiting 3 weeks before I put any type of coating on it, which make sense. So I have a bit of time for people to recommend stuff and, I guess, convince me.

If there are any meguiars employees around this forum (or lab rats are even better), and they have some spec/tech sheets on anything (even salt spray results, if any exists, or other), I wouldn't mind looking at it. Let's face it, It's not cheap stuff. But, is it good enough to satisfy this dizzy chemist with the marketing hype removed and at 5x the cost?

Feel free to drop links to other forum topics if all this has been asked/answered before.

Guess i'll have some trim questions later on as well. And clay questions, are they all created equal? Clay is clay, right?

TY!

I can't completely comment on all of your inquiries, however I can at least throw in some anecdotes on my experience. I'm somewhat in the same boat as you as far as caring for my car goes. My old car was one that was given to me by my family as a present in high school. For one reason or another, I didn't pay much attention to the paint on the car, I suppose I just didn't care too much. I just recently bought a new car, and this time around I paid out of pocket for this one. All of a sudden the detailing bug hit me, probably because I paid with my money and bought myself a halfway nice car. So since day 1, I've been taking immaculate care of it (or at least as best as I can). The paint was in pretty great shape for a 14 year old car, but nonetheless I decided to compound and polish it so I could start with a new, shiny clean slate. Doing this made the paint as smooth as glass, and removed most of the scratches (some are too deep to be removed that way). I went ahead and got myself some ULW, and went over the surfaces I had prepped. And it is a night and day difference. The paint legitimately feels like glass now, and looks the part as well. Water beads up very nicely, and as a byproduct of the smooth surface, dirt has a very hard time sticking to it. I have nothing but good things to say about it. I would definitely give it a shot if you haven't already. As far as it's longevity, I've had it on my paint for a month now, and even with the bad weather we've had, water still beads very nicely, although it somewhat loses its very smooth finish. However, a quik application of ultimate quik wax fixes that problem. Definitely makes the car much, much better looking, and I have no doubt it protects my paint from the intense sun and elements we have over here.