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Paint Discoloration HELP!!!

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  • #1

    Paint Discoloration HELP!!!

    Hi everyone. I'm new to the forum and I'm hoping your expertise can help me. I have a 2006 Nissan Murano. I got it back from the detailer and immediately noticed 4 patches of paint that were lighter than the rest of the hood. The largest spot is about the size of a half dollar but irregularly shaped. The finish feels smooth and doesn't feel like there is damage. It seems as though it's deep in the paint layer or something. After checking the TSBs, there is one about discoloration caused by the protective plastic they apply to new cars (NTB99-060c), but it is almost 3 years old.

    Is anyone familiar with this problem? Could this have somehow been caused by the detailer? It doesn't seem to be anything residual from the wax or polish. The finish feels as smooth as glass like the surrounding paint, it's only visually different.

    I have a theory. I think moisture has seeped into the finish. TSB NTB99-060c, PAINT SWELL/STAINS/SPOTS UNDER PAINT GUARD FILM, states:

    quote:
    "If a Nissan vehicle exhibits swelling, stains or spots on the paint finish (which appear milky
    or whitish on dark colored vehicles and dark-shaded or coffee-colored on light colored
    vehicles) immediately after the PGF is removed, the cause may be moisture collection
    under pockets/creases of the PGF. The paint may absorb moisture which may cause the
    affected paint finish area to temporarily discolor... The size of the swell, stain, or spot may range from a dime to a clinched fist and have an


    irregular shape..."

    The detailer used pressurized water when they washed it. Could this have forced moisture under the finish? The bulletin basically says to let it dry out in the sun (if it's warm, which it isn't) or use a heat gun. It says that it must be repaired within a short time or it will be permanent. I really don't want the detailer, who is not a paint technician, to try to fix this. I can only see them making it worse. I wonder if I could bring this to Nissan?

    I've attached a couple pics that I've boosted the contrast in order to highlight the spots.



    A close-up of a spot. The 2 small, black spots are nicks from pebble strikes. I don't think this is the cause of the discoloration because the other 3 spots have no damage nearby.

    Tags: None
  • #2
    Re: Paint Discoloration HELP!!!

    Did they machine buff the paint?

    That's what it looks like when you burn through the clear and expose the color coat underneath.

    The color coat is dull and gets its gloss and clarity from the clear coat. Usually when someone burns through the clear layer it starts out as a tiny spot and as the person continues to buff the spot grows and grows until they quit buffing.

    If it were a moisture problem then it would affect more of the paint, not small spot.

    Are the spots glossy or dull when you look at the surface of them as compared to the surrounding paint?

    Mike Phillips
    760-515-0444
    showcargarage@gmail.com
    "Find something you like and use it often"

    Comment

    • #3
      Re: Paint Discoloration HELP!!!

      Originally posted by Phatty McPatty View Post

      The bulletin basically says to let it dry out in the sun (if it's warm, which it isn't) or use a heat gun.

      It says that it must be repaired within a short time or it will be permanent.
      If it's not sunny and warm where you live, maybe try a hair blow dryer which will do what a heat gun would only with less heat so it will be safer.

      Of course that assumes the problem is moisture under the clear but cured clear coats are not very permeable so this just isn't adding up to what the problem is.

      Mike Phillips
      760-515-0444
      showcargarage@gmail.com
      "Find something you like and use it often"

      Comment

      • #4
        Re: Paint Discoloration HELP!!!

        Originally posted by Phatty McPatty View Post

        After checking the TSBs, there is one about discoloration caused by the protective plastic they apply to new cars (NTB99-060c), but it is almost 3 years old.
        3-years old and the no plastic film on the car correct? That is the detailer didn't put a plastic film on the car?

        You need to find out what the detailer did to your car, as in what chemicals he used, what machines he used and what pads he used.

        If the lighter spots were not there before you took him the car then something they did likely caused the problem and that could be one of two things,

        1) Burn through the clear layer and expose the color coat.
        2) Spill something on the paint that somehow stained the paint.

        Why did you take the car to the detailer in the first place? Was there something wrong with the paint that you wanted to have corrected?

        Mike Phillips
        760-515-0444
        showcargarage@gmail.com
        "Find something you like and use it often"

        Comment

        • #5
          Re: Paint Discoloration HELP!!!

          Originally posted by Mike Phillips View Post
          Why did you take the car to the detailer in the first place? Was there something wrong with the paint that you wanted to have corrected?

          Hey Mike, I took the car to get a wax job for the winter and a general cleaning inside and out. It was well maintained when we bought it 6 months ago.

          Originally posted by Mike Phillips View Post
          3-years old and the no plastic film on the car correct? That is the detailer didn't put a plastic film on the car?
          Not that I know of. I didn't get clear bra or anything if that's what you mean. I don't think it's exactly like the TSB but I'm thinking that maybe the high pressure water gun might have forced water under the clear.

          Originally posted by Mike Phillips View Post
          Did they machine buff the paint?

          Are the spots glossy or dull when you look at the surface of them as compared to the surrounding paint?

          The spots are as glossy and smooth as the surrounding paint so I don't think the clear coat has been buffed away. Could they repair it that well if they had? It's hard to show in the pictures, but up close the difference appears to be deep in the layer. The thing is, the paint doesn't look messed up besides the color being lighter. The "glitter" in the paint looks identical to the rest of the car. If my car were painted entirely like the spots it would look great! It's hard to tell from the photo but the car is a dark gray color, but the spots are light gray. The two shades blend together at the edges. The reason I'm really thinking it's water damage is that it looks a lot like a coffee stain that crawled outward across a napkin.

          I fear the detailer might do more harm than good and I'd rather not have to deal with the dealership. I think I will try the hair dryer idea as soon as it stops raining!

          Comment

          • #6
            Re: Paint Discoloration HELP!!!

            Just to clarify: the spots weren't there until the detailer worked on the paint?

            I just don't see a pressure washer forcing water/moisture under the clear. The paints are bonded together. If the clear has been buffed through, the paint underneath can still be shiny especially if just detailed (I have polished up BC color paint by hand with the clear missing so it can be done).

            I think if they didn't appear until after being detailed, like Mike has said, I would take it back to the detailer and find out what is going on. If you need to, go to a couple of certified body shops and get their opinions beforehand.

            Comment

            • #7
              Re: Paint Discoloration HELP!!!

              Tyler, no, the spots appeared after they waxed it. Initially I thought it was strange that when I picked up the vehicle, it was sitting outside in the pouring rain when there were empty spots in the garage. Everytime in the past, it's sitting in the garage so I can see it finished. I'm afraid they were trying to hide the spots. I hear what you're saying. It's pretty far fetched. But based on the TSB for Nissans, it's not impossible for water to seep into the finish.

              I talked with the detailer yesterday. He said that one of his guys did mention to him (only after I called) that they noticed the spots. Understandably, without seeing the spots himself, he can't really say what caused it. He gave me a few generic reasons, like maybe it was there before but it wasn't noticable bc it was covered up by a lot of oxidation. Of course I told him there wasn't oxidation bc the car has been well maintained. He did use a high powered water gun but with a diffusing tip. I suspect one of the guys used it too close to get off a bug splatter or something and forced water underneath the clear. Anyway, he told me to bring it in and he'll see what he can do about it. I'm hesitant to let him try to fix the issue. I'm afraid he will do more harm than good.

              It's been raining ever since so I haven't been able to try a hair dryer. I'm afraid I'm running out of time, so I'm planning to visit the dealership tonight and see what they think. If they can't heat gun it out, I'll take your advise and head to a couple body shops.

              Comment

              • #8
                Re: Paint Discoloration HELP!!!

                Wow, didn't realize I never posted the outcome of this saga. Since it was still under the 3/36 warranty, I took it to the Nissan dealer instead of the detailer just to see what they thought. Unlike many horror stories I've heard about dealers, they were very helpful. They sent pictures to corporate Nissan, which instructed the dealer to repaint the entire hood under warranty! When I asked what Nissan thought the cause was, he gave me a pretty generic response. "Since you didn't buy the vehicle new, the first owner might have been had it repainted at some point. I'm repainting it because I'm new to this area and am trying to increase my customer base." Didn't shed much light on the cause, but I didn't want to push it.

                Anyway, thanks for everyone's help!

                Patrick

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                • #9
                  Re: Paint Discoloration HELP!!!

                  Huh, cool indeed! Thanks for wrapping up the thread!

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