How to remove ingrained dirt from a white finish

[clarky75]

Hi All,

I am new to these forums from Melbourne Australia. I have a white VX SS Commodore. We are in water restrictions here, so it has been difficult to keep up the finish on my car. I just got some meguiars products and begun the long job.

I washed it firstly with the nxt car wash, next I ran the clay bar over it with the clay bar kit. The question I have is I have some brown what seems to be road grime or just really inground dirt especially on the boot and roof. I have ran the clay bar over twice, and while it is much better than it was I can still see this light brown scum or dirt inground into the paint.

Obviously I want to remove this before putting on the nxt wax I have, I have some scratch x 2.0 which I have not tried as yet, will that remove it or will I need something else.

Any advice would be much appreciated

Thanks

Clarky

[kimchiyuk]

Re: How to remove ingrained dirt from a white finish

First post, Welcome to MOL! As far as your stains, some pics would help. But, if a clay bar took some off, you should try some paint cleaner. You should start with something like swirlX, then move to something stronger if needed. Also, what is your method of application?

[Mike Phillips]

Re: How to remove ingrained dirt from a white finish

I can still see this light brown scum or dirt inground into the paint.

That's a pretty simple fix, any paint cleaner, cleaner/polish, rubbing or polishing compound, (Meguiar's new stuff that's safe), or even a simple cleaner/wax like Meguiar's Cleaner/Wax or ColorX should easily tackle the problem.

I wrote and article called "The Lesson White Paint Teaches Us" and it talks about this very same topic, it's called DIP or Dirt in Paint or simply staining and it happens over time to all paints that are exposed to the outdoor elements.

The point of my article was that with white paint you can usually see this staining effect and so you take action, (like you're doing), but if you have a medium to dark colored car you can't see the staining effect as easily but it's still taking place and that's why it's important to understand this and then use a paint cleaner or a cleaner/wax and not a finishing wax, finishing sealant or finishing hybrid.

[Michael Stoops]

Re: How to remove ingrained dirt from a white finish

Basically your can can have two different, generalized types of issues to deal with.

Above surface bonded contaminants.

• tree sap mist
• paint overspray
• industrial fallout
• bonded dust

Below surface defects.

• swirls
• scratches
• oxidation
• stains

Above surface contaminants are best removed with the clay bar, which you've obviously already done, and to good effect it sounds like. But since clay does not really interact with the paint itself, it doesn't really do anything for those issues below the surface.

That's where a paint cleaner comes in, and ScratchX falls squarely into this category. While there are more aggressive products available (Ultimate Compound, for example) ScratchX is a good starting point. When working by hand what you want to do is apply it to a small area, about the size of a microfiber towel, and work it in with fair amount of pressure. Don't be afraid to put some passion into this process - you're actually getting down into the paint to correct a problem. Whether you work the product in a circular motion or back and forth strokes is up to you, just make sure to use a soft foam wax applicator rather than terry cloth. Terry cloth could well mar the finish under an aggressive application. After just a couple minutes of working the product in, wipe it off while still wet. Now evaluate your progress in good light before proceeding. There's nothing worse than going over an entire vehicle only to find your process was lacking something and you didn't accomplish what you set out to do.

Of course, after using the ScratchX or any other paint cleaner you will need to wax the car.

[clarky75]

Re: How to remove ingrained dirt from a white finish

Hi All,

Thanks for the warm welcome and your responses. I have spent most of the morning getting out all the scratches blemishes with Scratch X. The good news is the scratch x removed all of the inground dirt from the roof and boot which was great, now I have a really clean smooth glass like surface ready to accept the NXT wax which I am just about to do now. It looks so much better, best it has in a long time.

I plan to keep this up now, do you guys recommend a polish after the scratch x or is it ok to go straight from scratch x to the nxt wax.

I also plan to use the quick detailer and quick wax in between my normal waxing to keep up the finish.

How often do you guys recommend the wax treatment, how long does the NXT last?

Thanks again for all your help

Clarky

[Murr1525]

Re: How to remove ingrained dirt from a white finish

You can use a pure polish if you like, Deep Crystal Polish is good and easy to use.

Or you could use the Cleaner/Wax that came with the clay kit, and then put the Nxt on.

Nxt 2.0 followed up with UQW after washing has lasted several months through the winter for me.

In the future, if you have no swirls, ColorX followed with Nxt 2.0 makes a nice quick detail, easy to do more often.

[clarky75]

Re: How to remove ingrained dirt from a white finish

Thanks all, I have since applied the NXT wax and the car looks amazing, especially being white they dont come up as good, but this looks incredible, while its not perfect and there are some spots that could do with some work, the car has been transformed.

I think I would need a machine polisher to get a better finish, but doing it all by hand, it still sure come up a treat

[Michael Stoops]

Re: How to remove ingrained dirt from a white finish

Glad to hear it all worked out so good for you, Clarky!

[searle]

Re: How to remove ingrained dirt from a white finish

Thanks all, I have since applied the NXT wax and the car looks amazing, especially being white they dont come up as good, but this looks incredible, while its not perfect and there are some spots that could do with some work, the car has been transformed.

Now the trick is to keep it that way. A few times a year do a "full detail" starting with a wash then claybar then mild cleaner (like SwirlX). The clay+cleaner will remove any new embedded dirt from the paint. Then (optionally) glaze and then sealer/wax (NXT etc). An All-In-One "quick detail" can be done with ColorX (cleaner+glaze+wax), but you should still clay a few times a year.

[TOGWT]

Re: How to remove ingrained dirt from a white finish

Chemical Paint Cleaning

Designed to enhance the depth and gloss while properly preparing the paint for a sealant or wax. Sometimes paint cleaners can have micro abrasives or they can be non-abrasive. They can remove micro-marring of the surface (i.e. light towel marks) but typically will not remove imperfections that require levelling the clear coat, but can remove some oxidation and mineral deposits.

Formulated with solvents and / or very fine abrasives (Kaolin or China Clay) to remove old wax, embedded dirt and light stains from paint; they help to restore gloss and remove light surface imperfection. They are designed to be used as often as required without measurably reducing paint thickness. Some paintwork cleaner’s act as 'All in One' products, so not only do they clean and polish, but also provide limited protection.

a) Detailer’s clay removes surface contaminates that are imbedded in the paint and any oxidised surface protection

b) Paint (pre-wax) cleaners are designed to remove old wax, oxidation, embedded dirt and light stains from your paint surface and can be used to maintain gloss without abrasives that thin your paint. They also help to restore gloss and remove light surface imperfections. Paint cleaners are a combination of light polishing abrasives and cleaning solvents. Most of their cleaning ability is provided by the chemical solvents, not the abrasives.

c) Decontamination and Acid Neutralization; vehicle manufacturer studies have shown that failure to remove environmental contaminants (like imbedded rail dust, acid rain, industrial fallout and other environmental contaminants) from paint film can cause premature degradation of the paint system. While clay products are useful for overspray, they cannot deep clean the surface and pores of the paint. This can only be accomplished through a thorough chemical cleaning and acid neutralization.

The ValuGard Neutralization System is the most recognized and approved chemical neutralization system in the industry. Vehicle manufacturer studies have shown that failure to remove environmental contaminants from paint film can cause premature degradation of the paint system. While clay products are useful for overspray, they cannot deep clean the surface and pores of the paint. This can only be accomplished through a thorough chemical cleaning and acid neutralization.

I recommend using a pre-wax cleaner after detailing clay and before the application of a wax or polymer sealant.. If your paint is in pristine condition, i.e. no visible surface scratches or marring; a quality paint cleaner will keep it looking that way so you can avoid having to use heavier polishes.

There are two distinct type; Abrasive and Chemical (solvent)

a) Zaino Z-PC Fusion Dual Action Paint Cleaner - a water-based formula with tri-particulate, diminishing abrasive system (no fillers or oils) that removes minor scratches, swirls, oxidation, wax build-up and other blemishes
b) The P21S gloss-enhancing chemical cleanser that contains fillers (Kaolin or China clay) will remove old wax, light swirls and oxidation. P21S Paintwork Cleanse can be applied by hand or with an orbital polisher.
Chemical solvents paint cleaners are good to use if you want to prep the paint surface prior to applying a wax (without polishing). My preference would be to use an IPA or DuPont’s PrepSol as they don’t leave any (silicone / mineral) oils or etc behind, as these can cause problems when polishing if they are not removed

Schedule: every three or four months (dependent upon environmental conditions and vehicle exposure) more often to remove ingrained dirt on light coloured paint. To optimize the reflective properties and appearance of the paint surface, it is best to regularly remove both imbedded and surface contaminants and dirt.

[Michael Stoops]

Re: How to remove ingrained dirt from a white finish

There are two distinct type; Abrasive and Chemical (solvent)

a) Zaino Z-PC Fusion Dual Action Paint Cleaner
b) The P21S gloss-enhancing chemical cleanser

There are quite few more options than just these two, however - many of them in Meguiar's line itself!!

While clay products are useful for overspray, they cannot deep clean the surface and pores of the paint. This can only be accomplished through a thorough chemical cleaning and acid neutralization.

We wholeheartedly agree on the first point, but the second point - that you can only deep clean the paint through a thorough chemical cleaning and acid neutralization - not so much. In fact, you even contradict this yourself when you mention the two products noted above.

[TOGWT]

Re: How to remove ingrained dirt from a white finish

Originally Posted by TOGWT
There are two distinct type; Abrasive and Chemical (solvent)

a) Zaino Z-PC Fusion Dual Action Paint Cleaner
b) The P21S gloss-enhancing chemical cleanser

I stated two distinct types not two products

Originally Posted by TOGWT
While clay products are useful for overspray, they cannot deep clean the surface and pores of the paint. This can only be accomplished through a thorough chemical cleaning and acid neutralization.

I don't see this as a contradiction (but then I could be a little biased This product uses an acid to clean paint contamination

[Michael Stoops]

Re: How to remove ingrained dirt from a white finish

Originally Posted by TOGWT
There are two distinct type; Abrasive and Chemical (solvent)

a) Zaino Z-PC Fusion Dual Action Paint Cleaner
b) The P21S gloss-enhancing chemical cleanser

I stated two distinct types not two products

Fully understood, and we only stated that there are many more products than these two - we didn't want anyone thinking they had to use one of these.

Originally Posted by TOGWT
While clay products are useful for overspray, they cannot deep clean the surface and pores of the paint. This can only be accomplished through a thorough chemical cleaning and acid neutralization.

I don't see this as a contradiction (but then I could be a little biased This product uses an acid to clean paint contamination

The contradiction rests in one statement claiming that the only way to deep clean the paint is with a chemical cleaning and acid neutralization and a further statement saying there are two type of paint cleaners, chemical and abrasive. If the first statement is true, then why would recommend, or even mention, abrasive paint cleaners? That is the conundrum. And yet, abrasive paint cleaners do indeed provide thorough and effective deep cleaning of the paint, even without the chemical component and acid neutralization.

[searle]

Re: How to remove ingrained dirt from a white finish

...That's where a paint cleaner comes in, and ScratchX falls squarely into this category. While there are more aggressive products available (Ultimate Compound, for example) ScratchX is a good starting point...

Just out of curiosity, why are you recommending ScratchX as the starting point for paint cleansing instead of SwirlX-2.0? I use both, but normally start with SwirlX-2.0 for normal paint cleansing and only move to ScratchX (or UC) if that is not enough (i.e. for defect removal more so than for paint cleansing). Just thought I'd ask ...

[Michael Stoops]

Re: How to remove ingrained dirt from a white finish

Just out of curiosity, why are you recommending ScratchX as the starting point for paint cleansing instead of SwirlX-2.0? I use both, but normally start with SwirlX-2.0 for normal paint cleansing and only move to ScratchX (or UC) if that is not enough (i.e. for defect removal more so than for paint cleansing). Just thought I'd ask ...

Your process of reaching for the least aggressive product in your arsenal is smart, and valid.

But the original poster stated that he already had ScratchX in his possession, although he was wondering if he might need something else. For this reason alone we recommended first trying what he already had on hand, especially since ScratchX is not a crazy powerful product. Had he only possessed a bottle of M105, however, we might have suggested he pick up a less aggressive product to try fist.