How to polish

[dbssoccer]

The red non-clear coat on my 95 T-100 was getting a bit chalky from months of neglect. I had invested in a PC DA and all the Meguiar's products (pads, backing plate, UC, UP and UW, etc) and was ready to go. First time with the DA.
After a good washing, the DA/UC went fine. Paint was red again! I switched to the yellow pad and started using the UP.
It seemed the product was drying out very fast and I was forced to start and stop the DA very frequently. I would get residue or swirls from the polish that I had a bear of a time getting wiped off. I tried some #7 and had about the same results. It was 85F outside but I was in the garage. I got tired of fighting with smudges and smears and used some Quick Detailer to clean things up. I figured this was a not approved technique but it did get rid of the smudges of polish.
I followed with a hand application of UW. All-in-all, the hood and front fenders look great. Some water spots but compared to what it was, the paint is outstanding. I left the rest of the truck for another day and would like to better understand the proper polish technique. I understand polish is more beneficial for darker paints.

Any technique help would be appreciated.

[Video]

Re: How to polish

Older paints sometimes let chemicals soak in. European cars like bmws have this problem.

Using a higher speed and too much pressure makes it worse.

Using quick detailer works good if the product dries. Work the product like normal, and if it dries before you finish spray a bit of detailed on the surface and rework it in.

As far as removing, make sure you use a very small amounts to begin with. You can also get a microfiber bonnet to go over the pad so you can use the da to remove wax etc

[dbssoccer]

Re: How to polish

Thanks Video, your explanation makes a lot of sense. It was like it was soaking in and the re-appearing. Is there a better technique for older paints other than a DA? I can't imagine a professional detailer messing with all these steps. DA-UP, use Quick Detail, then have another DA with a MF bonnet for a final clean up.

Maybe polishing by hand? I would think the polish needs to be polished (i.e. rubbed) to work properly which means a DA will be less work (from this perspective) than hand rubbing. But maybe not. Maybe just applying the UP and removing it is all that is intended. No serious rubbing/polishing required.

[Nick Winn]

Re: How to polish

How large of a section were you working in at a time and how many passes did you complete in each section?

[Video]

Re: How to polish

Well its not so bad when your used to it. I used to work at a dealership that used a particular compound that dried very quick. I kept a bottle of "quick shine" hanging in my back pocket so i could quickly grab it, give it a quick spray and then keep working the product. It was also very hard to remove so i was careful how much i used, and i worked it enough until it thinned out so it was easier.

On a big job i start with a rotary buffer with a wool pad. Then i switch to a da, compound again to remove the trail marks, then polish with the da, and again apply wax with the same da.

I would say go through the steps, work one panel at a time and wipe off the product after each panel, dont let it sit. At the very end, work in a wax or sealer with the da using a polishing pad and see how it turns out. Sometimes you have to play around.

I find this mostly happens when you finish with a polish and dont wax. A lot of times if you apply some wax with a da, when you strip the wax it takes the rest with it.

[dbssoccer]

Re: How to polish

Nicholas, I was working what I'd call a small area 20"x20". I tried to use a minimal amount of product. I made 3-4 overlapping passes with the DA. Some of it would wipe off fine but there were stubborn spots that were difficult. I was not running the DA very long and, long term, felt this on/off would not be good for the switch. Besides, it meant a lot of starting and stopping and re-starting. I don't imagine the DA ran more than 10 seconds as I attempted to really not let the product dry out.

Video, I was wondering if the wax step may clean-up the polish step. But I was thinking that at the end of the polish step the paint should be as deep and shiny as it ever would be. The wax is there to provide a crystal clear protective layer and not finish the polishing job. If waxing is to finishing the polishing it seems you will never know what difference the polish made until after you wax and then how can you tell if the shine is due the polish of the wax. Another thought is why bother polishing at all, if this is the case.

Am I to assume that using Quick Detailer will not diminish the shine of the polish had I not had to use it to clean up the polish smudges to begin with? Put another way, if I were to fully and successfully polish without Quick Detailer, will the shine be diminished by going over it with Quick Detail before I put the wax on? I feel the answer is obvious but I'd really like polish without using a "cleaner" that seems to be removing the polish.

[Top Gear]

Re: How to polish

I'll ask about two possibilities from prior experience. If these were foam pads, the product can disappear into the foam and do nothing for the paint, so you wind up drying out what is left much more quickly. Another reason I don't use foam anymore. Also, with a 95 Toyota, the failure of the clear coat is not "if", but "when". As it fails, it can soak up a lot of polishing oils, etc. The first could be fixed with an MF pad, but the second....well, just throwing it out there.

[dbssoccer]

Re: How to polish

Top Gear, I was wondering about the pad. It is a Meguiar's yellow foam pad, the one recommended for UP on a DA. Someone correct me if I got this wrong. But not ever having used a DA before, a couple of times I caused a bit of a mess as when I lifted the DA off the surface and it was still spinning a speed. Needless to say, I got spatters of UP all over everything including my very clean windows, surfaces that I considered done not to mention my clothes. The point is the pad seemed loaded with UP which supports your experience. Having said that, I need to learn about MF pads.

Your second point is somewhat in error. My '95 was, from the factory, a single paint. I learned this when I took it to the body shop for a fender repair. I was told the truck was single but that when they repainted this fender (entire left rear) they sprayed clear coat over the the color. It surprised the body shop as well.

Just today, I read an article about someone restoring an old Lincoln C and they left the first application of polish on for 24 hours so the paint could absorb the oils. They ended up with four applications of polish.

I'm off to learn about MF pads. Thanks.

[dbssoccer]

Re: How to polish

Ok. I just watched a video on a new MF system that Meguiar's had introduced. While their system pairs a pad with a compound it seems the finishing pad would work with UP as well. Comments from Nicolas or anyone from Meguiar's. A question however, is this new pad just the original foam pad covered with MF cloth? If so, it will probably soak up polishing product as bad, if not worse, than its non MF predecessor.

[drumdan]

Re: How to polish

I've had this happen with Ultimate Polish myself.

First thing, make sure the bottle is very well shaken. Next, don't over apply it. It has the tendency to do the same think on my car too. I start with four small pea size drops, and three for subsequent sections. With a Porter Cable I'm usually on speed 4, or 5 with it on a blue Buff and Shine polishing pad.

I do quite a few cars with it and find that obviously paint is a variable in how it behaves, but also ambient temperature and humidity levels can play a role in any products performance.

[drumdan]

Re: How to polish

Ok. I just watched a video on a new MF system that Meguiar's had introduced. While their system pairs a pad with a compound it seems the finishing pad would work with UP as well. Comments from Nicolas or anyone from Meguiar's. A question however, is this new pad just the original foam pad covered with MF cloth? If so, it will probably soak up polishing product as bad, if not worse, than its non MF predecessor.

No, the mf pad is a little more high tech than that. The microfiber material is bonded to the foam. The Polish doesn't usually penetrate this barrier.

Yes, Ultimate Polish works great on microfiber pads too. I love it with the Rupes yellow microfiber polishing pads.

[Top Gear]

Re: How to polish

Ah, well if it's single stage paint, then the question is still the same, that perhaps there are areas that are dried out, basically.

As for the MF pad, it is not like the thick foam in any way, except that there is a thin layer of foam backing. The part doing the work is a bed of microfibers against a vinyl fabric, which prevents liquids from soaking into the foam. The foam being thinner also transfers action from the machine's backing plate more directly to the paint. So, while MF pads are more aggressive if used the same way, they can be used gently, so a different technique develops since you don't have to work as much to get the same result.

If you really do have single stage paint, I'd do some searching of the forum here because there are a lot of threads discussing it. It could be that the foam you already have is fine for SS and the problem is elsewhere, however, the foam does soak up a lot of product. With any pad, you'll learn to avoid letting it spin freely, as you found out