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View Full Version : My first real experience with the Rotary



NickJRE
Jul 27th, 2006, 01:51 PM
After 3 years of being an avid PC user and finding that it was taking too long and I could not remove some defects I decided to step up and use a Rotary. I researched alot about pad speeds, pads and products and decided to give it a shot. I started doing my 92 LX last night but it got to dark and my garage light burned out go figure :wall:. So today after I got home from work I decided to go out at it again except on a donor vehicle. A 97 Jeep Cherokee that was BAD. Lots of heavy acid etching and swirl marks and scratches. I started off using Poorboys SSR 2.5 at 1200 via a Polishing pad, I felt that the polish was breaking down to fast and just did not seem to be working out very well. SO I broke out my old faithfuls #80 Speed glaze and #82 Swirl Free Polish both on Polishing Pads at the same speed. I wasimpressed. I started off with the 80 and it was looking good almost instantly. There was no holograms under my lighting or anything of the sort.. So I decided to move onto the #82. I worked the polish in good and decided it was time for the real test what it looked like in the sun. No Holograms no hazing no nothing it looked great here was my final results. Needless to say I was extremely happy and satsified with the results.

Here is a picture from before, It was a little dark outside so the damage isn't obvious... But if you look closely in what I circled you can see how bad the swirling when the sun hits it.
http://www.powerhouse-pc.com/Detailing/Jeep 003.jpg

After
http://www.powerhouse-pc.com/Detailing/Jeep 002.jpg

Mike Phillips
Jul 27th, 2006, 02:01 PM
Looks good! The rotary buffer sometimes gets a bad reputation for causing swirls, but in the right hands with the right pads and the right products it can be used to effectively remove swirls.

Be sure to apply wax also as the 80's serious is water-based and formulated to remove defects, not act as paint protectants. :xyxthumbs

NickJRE
Jul 27th, 2006, 02:02 PM
Almost forgot, Topping it with NXT :) I just wanted to show how it looked un-waxed

Thanks Mike!

TH0001
Jul 27th, 2006, 04:57 PM
How long did the 80 take to break down? I find that it breaks down in a matter of seconds, like two passes and its gone... Any ideas here?

wetlook
Jul 27th, 2006, 05:35 PM
Originally posted by Mike Phillips
Looks good! The rotary buffer sometimes gets a bad reputation for causing swirls, but in the right hands with the right pads and the right products it can be used to effectively remove swirls.

Be sure to apply wax also as the 80's serious is water-based and formulated to remove defects, not act as paint protectants. :xyxthumbs

Mike, surely you don't mean #80 Speed Glaze? From the Meg's video, it has some protectants and is actually recommended for newly painted surfaces. Did I remember it right?

wetlook
Jul 27th, 2006, 05:37 PM
Congrats on the upgrade NickJRE!

Could you give more details on how you primed the pad, applied the polish, moved the rotary, etc.?

NickJRE
Jul 27th, 2006, 06:02 PM
Originally posted by TH0001
How long did the 80 take to break down? I find that it breaks down in a matter of seconds, like two passes and its gone... Any ideas here?

#80 I found broke down fairly quick, However I found the arm speed has alot to do with how long it takes the product to break down. It did not take me long to do that section at all. Which is a huge difference from the PC. It would take much much longer.

NickJRE
Jul 27th, 2006, 06:19 PM
Originally posted by wetlook
Congrats on the upgrade NickJRE!

Could you give more details on how you primed the pad, applied the polish, moved the rotary, etc.?

Sure... Priming, I started off by spraying a small amount of non-silicone/carnuba/sealant based QD on the pad. I made an X Pattern with about the Amount of a Quarter on the pad. I took it and spread the polish lightly with the buffer turned off. I then started the buffer off at about 600 rpms and started working the polish a little bit, after I felt that I had the product settled ok I then cranked it up to normal speed (the steps happen pretty fast) I worked in roughly a 2x2' section. Moving the buffer is the toughest part I fell but once you have it down you barely notice. One big mistake is dragging the buffer don't control the buffer by the top handle. Use it as a guide, The control of the buffer I have found comes from the bottom by altering the direction you move it. For example guide the buffer the direction you want to go from the bottom, One thing I must state clearly I think it is almost impossible to keep the buffer 100%. I don't mean lifting the pad alot I mean ever so slightly to help with direction changes. I kept the Arm speed at a reasonable pace, Not very slow.. Not very fast just what felt right for the surface I was trying to polish. My technique may not be great, I did not leave any rotary holograms which wasn't too bad I thought for my first time.

I'm open to any suggestions anyone may have.

-Nick

NickJRE
Jul 29th, 2006, 01:30 PM
Ok checked in bright bright sun today and I noticed some slight and I mean slight holograms... Any ideas?

gbackus
Jul 29th, 2006, 03:03 PM
Originally posted by NickJRE
Ok checked in bright bright sun today and I noticed some slight and I mean slight holograms... Any ideas?

You could try #82 with a tan pad, but holograms are just the nature of the beast.

NickJRE
Jul 29th, 2006, 05:39 PM
From talking to people and what not... Basically, Some Holograms is normal you just need to follow up with like a PC?

zey
Jul 29th, 2006, 06:18 PM
NickJRE, it depends on...

1. Paint type
2. Technique
3. Product
4. Pad type
5. Buffer speed
6. Angle
7. Arm speed
8. Temperature
9. Humidity

I do get pretty swirl/hologram-free on certain paintwork with M82/W9006 combo. I still can accept a small amount of swirls/holograms on a daily used car - a fact of life. :)

NickJRE
Jul 29th, 2006, 06:22 PM
See what was weird about this was, There really wasn't really swirls left on the paint but if you hit just the right light it looked like there was some weird markings which looked like holograms.

zey
Jul 29th, 2006, 06:25 PM
And if you rock your body front/back/left/right, you'll see hologram effect right?

NickJRE
Jul 29th, 2006, 06:27 PM
Yes!!!! Bingo!

NickJRE
Jul 29th, 2006, 06:28 PM
By the way, I appreciate you taking your time to help me out!

zey
Jul 29th, 2006, 06:29 PM
You're most welcome!

NickJRE
Jul 29th, 2006, 06:33 PM
What are holograms like that generally caused from?

Mike Phillips
Jul 29th, 2006, 06:42 PM
Originally posted by wetlook
Mike, surely you don't mean #80 Speed Glaze? From the Meg's video, it has some protectants and is actually recommended for newly painted surfaces. Did I remember it right?

M80 Does contain a polymer that is body shop safe and does offer the paint some protection, but it's not like it's a dedicated wax or paint protectant.

Mike Phillips
Jul 29th, 2006, 06:51 PM
Originally posted by NickJRE
What are holograms like that generally caused from?

Anytime you touch the paint the potential exists to instill a scratch. Your job is to do everything you can to reduce the potential.

When you bring a buffing pad, spinning under the action of a direct drive rotary buffer, the rotating pad and the chemical of your choice is touching the paint. Thus the potential exists to instill swirls and holograms.

Your job is to use all of your skills and abilities along with your choice of pad and product to reduce the potential to instill swirls and scratches.

Don't forget where the finish started at.

NickJRE
Jul 29th, 2006, 07:02 PM
Ok it's making more sense to me now :)

So what would you recommend to remove the holograms?

A little background about the pad I used.. I feel it may be the source of the problem. I bought it from a Local Place, It was orange in color which to me that always usually means a cutting-light cutting pad. He swear it was not a cutting pad yet a polishing pad.

Do I try #80 speed glaze again with a Yellow Meguairs Polishing Pad via the Rotary or should I go to the PC? I'd really like to use the rotary again but i'm not sure if that is the proper way to go?

Mike Phillips
Jul 29th, 2006, 07:04 PM
Originally posted by NickJRE

So what would you recommend to remove the holograms?



Change the action of how you touch the paint. Switch from Rotary Direct Drive Action, to Oscillating Action

:confused: :confused: :confused:

Mike Phillips
Jul 29th, 2006, 07:06 PM
From Hot Topics


Read through this for process...

http://meguiarsonline.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=6224

Mike Phillips
Jul 29th, 2006, 07:08 PM
READ through both of these to bring your understanding of what can, and what cannot be done with a rotary buffer...

Again... from Hot Topics


http://meguiarsonline.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=4929

http://meguiarsonline.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=4966

NickJRE
Jul 29th, 2006, 07:31 PM
Mike, I thank you!! This makes perfect sense and you know what the more I think about this it makes even more sense to me! Thanks for those threads they were a huge help so now critique this...

Since the hood is very bad here is my plan of attack,

#83 DACP on a Polishing Pad @ 1500 RPMs making extra sure not buff too dry.
#80 Speed Glaze on a Polishing pad @ 1500 RPMs (to clean up any marring left by #83)
#82 Swirl Free Polish on a Finishing Pad via PC at about 4-5
Finish with M21 or NXT

Estranged
Oct 25th, 2006, 10:25 AM
I would skip #80 and go right to the PC with #82 and a POLISHING pad - you should be able to remove any marring the #83 and rotary left behind. To me the polishing pad is the best of both worlds - when used with a mild to light polish it doesn't marr, yet is still effective in cleaning up hazing/light hologramming.

zey
Oct 25th, 2006, 10:51 AM
The method which I prefer most is...

M83/W8006/RB
M82/W9006/RB

Pretty much perfect combi...