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Mike Phillips
Jul 1st, 2004, 07:28 AM
Topping NXT aka "How to top one type of wax with a different type of wax (http://meguiarsonline.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=1648)

There is always a lot of talk about topping NXT with other products, because this is a popular topic, I thought I would offer this simple suggestion.

If you think you would like to apply a topper over NXT, before you apply your choice of a topper over the entire finish, first do a side-by-side comparison and inspect your results carefully to insure that the test area does in fact look better than NXT by itself before applying your choice of topper to the entire finish. If you apply your choice of a topper to the entire car without comparing, you will never know if it improved or diminished the results created by the NXT alone.


Here's how to do a test spot,

First - Wait until you have two thin, uniform applications of NXT Tech Wax over the entire finish. Two thin applications always look better than one application.

Second - Find a nice flat panel like the hood or deck lid so that you can look down on the finish while standing over it. Apply your choice of a topper to a square section about one foot square being careful to do so in a way as to have a very distinct section with only the topper in this section. Allow the topper to dry according to the instruction and the remove with a microfiber polishing cloth or a clean, soft 100% cotton terry cloth towel. To be fair, you should apply a second coat in this same section to insure a uniform application. Again, apply and remove according to the product's directions.

After you applied and removed your choice of a topper carefully, inspect the two areas under different lighting conditions. Different lighting conditions will allow your eyes to see the different dimensions of your finish, such as richness, gloss, shine and clearness or clarity. View the two areas from different angles, from directly overhead, and with a light source centered in the area, like the sun. You may also want to have some friends compare the two areas also, a second set of fresh eyes may see something you miss, especially after you've been working on the finish and staring at the paint for hours.

If after doing this side-by-side comparison test in one small area, your eyes will tell you whether or not you want to continue with applying the topper to the entire finish.

Hope this helps...

Mike Phillips

rkollman
Feb 5th, 2007, 11:46 AM
Topping NXT (http://meguiarsonline.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=1648)


Topping NXT

There is always a lot of talk about topping NXT with other products, because this is a popular topic, I thought I would offer this simple suggestion.

If you think you would like to apply a topper over NXT, before you apply your choice of a topper over the entire finish, first do a side-by-side comparison and inspect your results carefully to insure that the test area does in fact look better than NXT by itself before applying your choice of topper to the entire finish. If you apply your choice of a topper to the entire car without comparing, you will never know if it improved or diminished the results created by the NXT alone.


Here's how to do a test spot,

First - Wait until you have two thin, uniform applications of NXT Tech Wax over the entire finish. Two thin applications always look better than one application.

Second - Find a nice flat panel like the hood or deck lid so that you can look down on the finish while standing over it. Apply your choice of a topper to a square section about one foot square being careful to do so in a way as to have a very distinct section with only the topper in this section. Allow the topper to dry according to the instruction and the remove with a microfiber polishing cloth or a clean, soft 100% cotton terry cloth towel. To be fair, you should apply a second coat in this same section to insure a uniform application. Again, apply and remove according to the product's directions.

After you applied and removed your choice of a topper carefully, inspect the two areas under different lighting conditions. Different lighting conditions will allow your eyes to see the different dimensions of your finish, such as richness, gloss, shine and clearness or clarity. View the two areas from different angles, from directly overhead, and with a light source centered in the area, like the sun. You may also want to have some friends compare the two areas also, a second set of fresh eyes may see something you miss, especially after you've been working on the finish and staring at the paint for hours.

If after doing this side-by-side comparison test in one small area, your eyes will tell you whether or not you want to continue with applying the topper to the entire finish.

Hope this helps...

Mike Phillips

excellent information, thanks!

Mike Phillips
Feb 5th, 2007, 11:53 AM
Thanks rkollman,

It's interesting that you've made the first comment on this topic since it was posted Jul 1st, 2004, 08:28 AM , that's 2.5 years ago!

Interesting in that it's a popular topic of discussion on this forum and on so many other forums, but to date we've never seen anyone on any other forum explain the how and why behind topping.


;) :xyxthumbs

Sydster
Feb 5th, 2007, 03:46 PM
Thanks for the very useful info Mike. :bow

BuckeyeMCS
Feb 14th, 2007, 05:58 AM
Mike,
I followed your advice (not with NXT but with 21)
Topped with P21s and could not see a difference between the two.
Thanks for saving me some $$$ :xyxthumbs

Mike Phillips
Feb 14th, 2007, 06:36 AM
Mike,
I followed your advice (not with NXT but with 21)
Topped with P21s and could not see a difference between the two.
Thanks for saving me some $$$ :xyxthumbs

Always at your service. :bow

Dee
Feb 14th, 2007, 06:59 AM
Mike, you probably haven't gotten any traction on this because NXT is so good you really don't need to top it. Now perhaps some of the other excellent products can be topped with NXT, but after I've used NXT the only other thing to top it with is more NXT:-)

Mike Phillips
Feb 14th, 2007, 07:16 AM
Mike, you probably haven't gotten any traction on this because NXT is so good you really don't need to top it. Now perhaps some of the other excellent products can be topped with NXT, but after I've used NXT the only other thing to top it with is more NXT:-)

You make a great point, NXT Tech Wax is a great wax that doesn't really improve when topped with anything, the only reason we wrote this article is because so many people want to try topping one wax with a different wax to try to take their results to a higher level that we wanted to point out some tips and guidelines for doing this and we didn't see anything like this written up on any other detailing discussion forum, even though the topic is talked about on other forums.

So we wrote an article on the topic. :D


We didn't want to see people wasting their time chasing after the unattainable in some cases but we also know that you can top some waxes with a different wax and actually take the finish to a higher level, so while the article is titled

Topping NXT


In reality it's a "how-to" article on topping any wax with any other wax, not just NXT. With some common sense guidelines added to insure people doing this don't waste their time.

imacarnut
Feb 14th, 2007, 10:39 AM
NXT Tech Wax is a great wax that doesn't really improve when topped with anything

agreed. i applied two thin coats of nxt over a month ago and it's been doing an excellent job of getting me through winter thus far... :)

bernard78
Feb 14th, 2007, 05:00 PM
Thank you Mike for the advise. I used play around with this topping, that topping. I guess sometimes we get influence by the things we read. But lately, I just use 1 single type of wax/sealants by itself, sometimes 2 thin coats or just 1 coat. Now I'm just seeking for a balance between a protection & shine. Nothing extreme anymore. Hehe...maybe I'm getting old I guess. :)

truongsean
Mar 5th, 2007, 02:57 PM
Hi Mike,
Thank you for an interesting thread here. I just washed, clayed, #80 on my 91 black MR2. Only half the car is done so far. :( Lots of hours... Anyhow, I applied 2 thin coats of #16 on the car. I was thinking about putting on the 3rd coat or LSP with NXT Tech LIQUID wax. However, I am a bit concern since there was another thread where you mention that using M26 liquid remove some of #16.

So I was wondering if I applied NXT Tech wax would remove #16 at all?

thanks.
Sean



Here's the other thread:
Re: #16 over #26
<HR style="COLOR: #999999" SIZE=1><!-- / icon and title --><!-- message -->Quote:
<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=6 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD class=alt2 style="BORDER-RIGHT: 1px inset; BORDER-TOP: 1px inset; BORDER-LEFT: 1px inset; BORDER-BOTTOM: 1px inset">Originally Posted by jarred767 http://archive.meguiarsonline.com/forums/images/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://meguiarsonline.com/forums/showthread.php?p=164204#post164204)
I realized in my last post that I never really said what the process was that I was going to be using.
Wash
Clay
M83 by DA (if needed)
M80 by DA
M21 by DA
Liquid M26 by DA
M16 (probably by hand)

Hopefully it all works out

</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
This combination should give the best results for what you're trying to accomplish.

Quote:
<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=6 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD class=alt2 style="BORDER-RIGHT: 1px inset; BORDER-TOP: 1px inset; BORDER-LEFT: 1px inset; BORDER-BOTTOM: 1px inset">Originally Posted by jarred767 http://archive.meguiarsonline.com/forums/images/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://meguiarsonline.com/forums/showthread.php?p=164204#post164204)

To your question mike, it is the liquid version of M26, does this make much difference to the process or final outcome?
</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
Just curious...

There's some characteristics about M16 that makes it unique and there's some characteristics about paste versus liquid that make application different. If you were to apply the liquid version of M26 over the M16 because it's a liquid in form this together with the agitation of however you apply it would act to loosen and re-liquify some of the M16 which would somewhat defeat what you're trying to do.

M16 because its a thick, hard wax, won't really tend to do the above. Thus my first comment to the process you outlined.
<!-- / message --><!-- sig -->

cherrycougar
Mar 31st, 2007, 08:43 PM
First off I want to say that thanks to NXT my car has survived the harsh Canadian winter here with the ton of road salt and sand and other **** completely unscathed. I only wax occasionally in the winter here and if anything the finish looks better than ever.

The only thing I've found to "top" NXT liquid is NXT spray and the best results I've gotten is to put a coat of liquid followed by a coat of spray. The liquid offers superior protection and the spray even better gloss and for me at least I've used 2 coats of liquid and the one and one and you don't need a side by side to spot the superior shine of using both.

I ran just the spray for a while last fall and while nothing outshines it, it doesn't quite offer the same protection as the liquid which is why it's twice as expensive. Both together though with a generous application of each offer a completely awesome combo that will make your car's finish stand out like no other. I want to give people the experience of seeing the best damn shine on a car they have ever seen in their lives and NXT has made this possible.

As far as other waxes go you don't put an inferior wax over a superior one if you don't want to lose some gloss and there's nothing superior to NXT.

Thejoyofdriving
Mar 31st, 2007, 09:14 PM
I was just told by meguiars that you cant layer waxes:confused:

cherrycougar
Apr 1st, 2007, 04:14 AM
I'm not sure what is meant here by "can't" although if it makes you feel better I can tell you that I've "layered" waxes for about 30 years and I've never been arrested yet for it and both myself and my cars survived the ordeals :D

Some people will tell you that it's a waste of time though and you're pretty much removing the first coat with the second. This will be true to a certain point depending on the wax but with even the least durable wax you're going to be ahead by a meaningful amount, and with something like NXT which is very durable it's going to be quite meaningful, in my experience anyway. I'm not a scientist but if they are telling you that you shouldn't ever apply 2 coats then the science and the real world aren't on the same page. Preferably though you're using something else though for the second coat but again the second coat has to be something that's glossier or you ARE wasting your time.

On the other hand it's not really necessary to do especially with NXT and you'll get fabulous results even with a single thin coat. I've found though that if you really want the real eye candy look that will get stared at by everyone in admiration you're going to have to put the work into it.

Mike Phillips
Apr 1st, 2007, 08:01 AM
I was just told by meguiars that you cant layer waxes:confused:

Who at Meguiar's told you this?


That's not what it says here...


Layering (http://www.meguiarsonline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2167)

Thejoyofdriving
Apr 1st, 2007, 08:05 AM
I was told by John at costumer service, he says the chemical make up of wax does not allow it to adhear to its self. he said if you go over it a second time all you are going to do is get spots you missed and even it out, but you cant layer it.:confused::confused::confused: Mike help!!

Mike Phillips
Apr 1st, 2007, 08:11 AM
I was told by John at costumer service, he says the chemical make up of wax does not allow it to adhear to its self. he said if you go over it a second time all you are going to do is get spots you missed and even it out, but you cant layer it.:confused::confused::confused: Mike help!!

To some degree John's right. It all depends upon which definition of the word "Layer" you use. Did you read all the way through the above link I gave you or did you just post away?

Slow down your posting and spend some more time reading. Start with this one,

Meguiar's 5-Step Paint Care Cycle (http://meguiarsonline.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=2409)

Then this one,

Layering (http://www.meguiarsonline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2167)


Read all the way through them and then let the information soak in.

Mike Phillips
Apr 1st, 2007, 08:12 AM
I posted the link to Layering at 8:01 and you posted at 8:05, that's less than 4 minutes?

Thejoyofdriving
Apr 1st, 2007, 08:16 AM
well you told me to tell you who told me, didnt you?

Mike Phillips
Apr 1st, 2007, 08:29 AM
well you told me to tell you who told me, didn't you?

Yes I did and thank you and as I already posted John's right, spend some time reading the thread on layering.

It's Sunday morning as I type this and it's a good idea to take at least one day off a week and spend time with your family. Spending the entire day watching the forum and answering questions like yours is a great idea... but not today.

Mike Phillips
Apr 1st, 2007, 08:31 AM
well you told me to tell you who told me, didnt you?

How about taking the day off?

Thejoyofdriving
Apr 1st, 2007, 12:53 PM
I dont know if that stuff on that thread is right, just like you said mike"not every thing you read on forums is right". Take a day off? Me?!.....and miss siting on the computer talking to you and learning, never.:rolleyes:

Mike Phillips
Apr 1st, 2007, 01:42 PM
I dont know if that stuff on that thread is right, just like you said mike"not every thing you read on forums is right". Take a day off? Me?!.....and miss siting on the computer talking to you and learning, never.:rolleyes:


You should have taken the friendly advice you wre given and taken the day off. :wavey


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xantonin
May 5th, 2009, 05:00 PM
My question is the opposite to this topic:

What wax is better top top with NXT?

For example, apply Gold Class Wax, then apply NXT Gen 2.0.

Also, for the record here is where I found information on layering: http://www.meguiars.com/faq/index.cfm?faqCat=General%20Questions&faqQuestionID=13&section=_13#_13

I've done well over a ton of reading into both the forum and as much of the website as I can, so much information to absorb. According to the FAQ, Gold Class wax is considered a Polish/Wax, and NXT gen a Sealant, therefor it makes sense in my head that NXT would go great on top of Gold Class? ( product info from http://www.meguiars.com/faq/index.cfm?faqCat=Paint%20Care&faqQuestionID=53&section=_53#_53 where it lists Gold Class as a Polish/Wax)

Mike Phillips
May 5th, 2009, 05:26 PM
My question is the opposite to this topic:

What wax is better top top with NXT?




Hope this doesn't confuse you but both Gold Class and NXT are in the category of polish/wax, that is they both add lots of gloss plus protection.


Gold Class contains a blend of natural ingredients and synthetic ingredients as such it's not considered a paint sealant.
NXT contains only synthetic ingredients so it's considered a paint sealant.

It's all explained in this thread,

Is it a wax? Or a paint sealant? (http://meguiarsonline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=28676)


Just to note, Meguiar's doesn't recommend toping one type of finishing wax with another type of finishing wax. I wrote this article because I knew people would do this outside of the no recommendation on the procedure and wanted people to think about what they were doing and to TEST their process to a small area first to make sure they were getting the results they were looking for.

This is all explained in the first message of this thread.


:)

xantonin
May 5th, 2009, 05:31 PM
Currently I've got over 5 tabs open on threads I still haven't read that were linked to. I'm sure I've already read through more than 10 with hours after hours of materiel. I hate being the guy to ask a question that was answered already, or I hate being the one asking for help when there's plenty of self-help options available and I can do it myself.

But true you're right, that was explained. I just thought I'd throw it out there and I'm glad I did because you clarified my misconception on the definition of each product being a polish/wax/sealant.

Bounty
May 5th, 2009, 05:50 PM
1. Gold Class contains a blend of natural ingredients and synthetic ingredients as such it's not considered a paint sealant.

2. NXT contains only synthetic ingredients so it's considered a paint sealant.



I really don't want to bring up an old argument from the NXT 1.0 days but what is the official Meguiar's stance on whether or not there are cleaners (minor or otherwise) in NXT 2.0 sealant? If the NXT does contain cleaners does that not automatically make it a "base layer" product in that if it's layered on top of something else it will wholly or partially remove it?

the_invisible
Jun 23rd, 2009, 09:11 PM
My question is the opposite to this topic:

What wax is better top top with NXT?

For example, apply Gold Class Wax, then apply NXT Gen 2.0.


As previously stated or implied, both NXT and Gold Class have polishing abrasive properties. Topping them over one another would ultimately remove the previous layer.

I find that the Yellow Wax is the best for topping. Though after claying, polishing, and then applying NXT, I would be too exhausted with the final layer of Yellow Wax. That's what a few individuals on the other automotive forums are doing. They are pretty happy with the result of using yellow wax over NXT2.0.

Using NXT or gold class prior to using Yellow Wax would ultimately remove even more fine scratces that couldn't be removed with, say, ScratchX 2.0 or Ultimate Compound.

Calais
Jun 24th, 2009, 08:06 AM
I want to apply M80 via G110 followed by M07 topped with 2 coats of NXT 2.0. Do you guys think the two coats of glaze are overkill or does that combination sound appropriate? In theory, it sounded like a combo that would produce a nice shine and unbelievable protection. It's for my meticulously detailed daily driver.

Tuck91
Jun 24th, 2009, 08:13 AM
I want to apply M80 via G110 followed by M07 topped with 2 coats of NXT 2.0. Do you guys think the two coats of glaze are overkill or does that combination sound appropriate? In theory, it sounded like a combo that would produce a nice shine and unbelievable protection. It's for my meticulously detailed daily driver.

You may or may not notice a difference with M07 since M80 has a lot of polishing oils in it.

After M80 try M07 in a test spot and see if you can tell the difference.

if not then just follow up with 2 coats of NXT Generation Tech Wax 2.0

Calais
Jun 24th, 2009, 07:06 PM
You may or may not notice a difference with M07 since M80 has a lot of polishing oils in it.

After M80 try M07 in a test spot and see if you can tell the difference.

if not then just follow up with 2 coats of NXT Generation Tech Wax 2.0

Gotcha.