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Superior Shine
Mar 10th, 2004, 06:22 PM
This vehicle was "polished" at the dealership. It was left with swirls, buffer trails and cob webbing.

The owner of this car sent it back to the dealership twice to get an approperate polish job. It always returned the same or worst.



http://www.superiorshine.com/hallofshame2.JPG

http://www.superiorshine.com/hallofshame3.JPG

http://www.superiorshine.com/DETAILING%20001.jpg

Superior Shine
Mar 10th, 2004, 06:24 PM
Here are more pics of the damage.


http://www.superiorshine.com/DETAILING%20002.jpg http://www.superiorshine.com/DETAILING%20003.jpg http://www.superiorshine.com/DETAILING%20006.jpg

Superior Shine
Mar 10th, 2004, 06:26 PM
This vehicle also had etching from ????? It was on the right side of the hood, fender and door.


http://www.superiorshine.com/DETAILING%20012.jpg http://www.superiorshine.com/DETAILING%20016.jpg http://www.superiorshine.com/DETAILING%20017.jpg

Superior Shine
Mar 10th, 2004, 06:32 PM
The damage had to be color-sanded out.

This first pic is of the etching after I sanded the finsh lightly so I could get a contrast from the depth of the etching and the sanding marks.

http://www.superiorshine.com/DETAILING%20027.jpg

http://www.superiorshine.com/DETAILING%20047.jpg

Here is the hood with all the etching sanded out. I used Meguiars 2000 grit paper and wet it with a spray water bottle with a dash of Meguiars carwash soap.

http://www.superiorshine.com/DETAILING%20030.jpg

Superior Shine
Mar 10th, 2004, 06:36 PM
http://www.superiorshine.com/DETAILING%20050.jpg

I used #85 diamond cut with a wool CUTTING pad to remove the sanding marks. I followed that with DACP and a wool POLISHING pad. Then DACP with w-7009 (i think thats the part number) maroon pad.

Here is a pic of my pads. I keep them in plastic freezer bags when not in use. http://www.superiorshine.com/DETAILING%20042.jpg

Superior Shine
Mar 10th, 2004, 06:40 PM
Here is a pic of where I did it. Today was a weird almost 90 degree windy winter day. Heat and dust was a problem. I kept the vehicle in the shade as much as I could. I also preceded any buffing with damp terry towel to wipe away dust and dirt that was blown onto the BMW. Man would I love to have a shop.
http://www.superiorshine.com/DETAILING%20056.jpg

Superior Shine
Mar 10th, 2004, 06:42 PM
Here is the vehicle after the diamond cut, DACP, #66 (rotory and the DA) You can see some splatter and buffing dust on the car.

http://www.superiorshine.com/DETAILING%20058.jpg

Before applying my sealant I like to power rinse the vehicles of all the dust.

http://www.superiorshine.com/DETAILING%20060.jpg

Superior Shine
Mar 10th, 2004, 06:48 PM
7 and 1/2 hours later, shes beautiful! I topped her off with #20 polymer sealant. NXT hasn't hit the west coast yet (at least not where I am) The tires and plastic wheel wells wear #40.

http://www.superiorshine.com/DETAILING%20066.jpg

http://www.superiorshine.com/DETAILING%20068.jpg

http://www.superiorshine.com/DETAILING%20075.jpg

Superior Shine
Mar 10th, 2004, 06:50 PM
Allot of work, but what a sense of satisfaction when it is all done.


http://www.superiorshine.com/DETAILING%20087.jpg http://www.superiorshine.com/DETAILING%20088.jpg

Slats
Mar 10th, 2004, 07:40 PM
Great job. You have a lot of confidence to be able to wet sand a 70+ K BMW!!! It turned out nice. Was 2000 grit sandpaper all you used or did you have to use less abrasive paper after the 2000??

Slats

Mike Phillips
Mar 10th, 2004, 08:21 PM
Where to start....

First - Excellent job of capturing the defects, (swirls & etchings), on film, or I guess I should say pixels. The one thing I struggle with the most is capturing defects on/in paint. It’s important to capture the defect before removing it because it’s such a strong visual explanation of the problem that words alone fail to describe.

Your pictures are excellent. This thread alone, is a documentary of how to remove swirls with both before and after proof, (photos), that should send the owners and managers of all new car dealerships into hiding.

The pictures you posted of the dealership-induced swirls are embarrassing.

To take a fine automobile like the BMW 745il and destroy the delicate clear coat finish with the atrocious and unsightly swirls the way your photos have captured is a crime against all auto enthusiasts worldwide. As a brother in arms, that has performed the exact repair procedures as you have outlined in your post here, I can vouch for accomplishment, that what you have done is monumental, in the scope of the detailing world.

It is so easy for anyone with a breath in their body to swirl-out a pristine finish and call themselves a, Detailer.

It is so hard to undo the damage an amateur has inflicted, only to accept your pay and move on to the next job because the owner doesn't understand how thin and scratch-sensitive the finish on their pride & joy really is.

The results you have shared here with us is a testimony to both the craft, and your craftsmanship. Truly, polishing paint is an art form. There is so much more to it than simply, "Wax-on, Wax-off, (to quote a line from the "Karate Kid").

I have seen many write-ups on other forums, but I don’t think any of these have ever painted a picture so vivid of the results that are possible by a talented craftsman, using the appropriate products and procedures. One of the few that come to mind is this one by 2hotford (http://www.showcargarage.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=177). Upon arriving home, and turning on my computer to read your post and see your pictures, I am truly impressed.


Second – The environment in which you achieve your results. In case anyone reading this doesn’t understand, allow me to explain. Working outdoors, even under the cover of a canopy, exposes your work, (i.e. the finish upon which you are working), to constant contamination from airborne dust and other pollutants. When machine cleaning and polishing using a rotary buffer, it is vital that you keep the surface as clean as possible at all times in order to produce a swirl free finish.

For Superior Shine to achieve the results he has clearly demonstrated, (through his photographs), in an open-air environment, is truly a testimony of his dedication to the craft and his passion for doing it right the first time.

As documented by his 7th post, after his machine cleaning steps, and before his application of his LSP, (Last Step Product), he takes the extra-step, of power washing the entire vehicle to insure it completely squeaky clean before progressing to his final and last step. The step that will either make, or break all his previous hard work.


Third – Your After shots.

The reflection shots you captured are crystal clear. The sun reflection shots are both cobweb and swirl free. While I’m not a photography expert, nor an expert at recognizing retouched photos, from what I can see on my monitor, your photo’s are the real deal. That is they are raw photos. Except for cropping, (if any), and resizing, (if any), they have not been touched-up, or monkeyied with, in any way. For this, you earn my respect. (In case anyone ever doubted it, #20 Polymer Sealant is no slouch)


Fourth – For taking the time to stop everything you were doing, wipe off your hands, then pick up your camera and take pictures of each step along the way, I commend you.

It would be so much faster to just detail the car, versus stop and document your progress with a camera. But that’s not the end of the story.

Then, at the end of the day, after pouring your blood, sweat and tears into someone else’s ride, you took the time to,

1) Transfer your photos to a folder on your hard drive
2) Preview each photo and cull out the bad ones, while renaming and saving the good ones
3) Cropping and resizing each photo to tell a story
4) Uploading each photo to your gallery
5) Write a cohesive post, that outlines in detail the products and procedures you performed, and then insert the appropriate image.

I thank you, and appreciate your contribution.

It would have been so much easier to skip all of the above, and kept everything to yourself. Instead you took your time to share with the community to show others how it’s done.

2-thumbs up!

Mike

Elite M.D.
Mar 11th, 2004, 12:47 PM
Nice pictures, write up and most importantly nice job! I saw your post on a couple other forums about this car and I knew you would end up having to detail it. Im glad you did because you do great work. That is a sweet BMW now ;)

Rick
Mar 11th, 2004, 04:04 PM
Wow, I can't believe a dealership could have such untrained people buffing a car and screwing it up so badly, especially a BMW dealership! That has got to be one of the most outstanding polishing jobs I've seen. Thanks for the time you took to do the write up, I know it takes a good 45 min at least to do the whole process.

Dave Holmes
Mar 11th, 2004, 09:33 PM
I'm in awe. Not only did you do an incredible job, but you taught those of us less skilled/experienced what it means and takes to do it right.
I understand what Mike mentioned about doing it in the open environment being difficult/more time consuming. I do mine without the benefit of any cover (maybe I'll get a canopy this year if my wife really loves me ;) ). On even a relatively calm day, airborne dust, etc is a constant battle to get off the surface you're working on. To get the results you did in that environment shows a dedication that is not found very often in many fields nowadays. I commend you for that. And then to have the presence of mind to document the repairs.....
Back to the canopy... Setting up 2 is a good idea. While contemplating getting mine, I didn't want to hassle with moving the car all the time to keep the area I'm working on in the shade. Looks like you found a good solution for that. Would detachable sides be worth paying extra for, or are they too much trouble setting up, limit room, etc?
Thanks.

Dave

Rick
Mar 12th, 2004, 12:16 PM
Random thought here reguarding the shades. Is there any reason why you couldn't put some thing that could roll down on the sides to make it more of a portable mini enclosure?

Open Air
Mar 12th, 2004, 02:03 PM
WOW!

WOW!

and uhhhhhhh....WOW!

I'm stunned.

Great Job.

Teak
Mar 12th, 2004, 04:40 PM
Excellent work.

Eric

mhoffman
Mar 12th, 2004, 06:24 PM
AMAZING JOB!!!!


Allot of work, but what a sense of satisfaction when it is all done.

I have a sense of satisfaction from just reading how you restored an amazing shine to that awesome car. When I move on to color sanding I am going to make sure I memorize how you did it. Thanks for sharing your knowledge.

AutoNova
Mar 12th, 2004, 10:28 PM
I really like your set-up with your van and all, can you post a few pictures of the interior and the equipment you use? As someone wanting to get into the mobile side of the business I would like to see your set-up and get an idea of what the van and extras cost you?

Superior Shine
Mar 12th, 2004, 10:33 PM
Thank you for the kind words. I love detailing and really enjoyed reading mikes step by step posts so I decided to write one myself.

It was fun.

Seems like there is allot of interest in colorsanding. I do allot of complete colorsand/wet sanding jobs on many classic show cars. I will be sure to include a step by step type post on my next job.

Glyn RS2
Mar 13th, 2004, 02:32 AM
Absolutely awesome job.
I hope the dealership paid you well. You should have some commision on the sale - the car was previously unsaleable and now there will be a queue round the block for it.
Like Mike said work like that is a true art form.

msmarcus
Mar 13th, 2004, 03:26 AM
Great Thread!! For us amateurs, it is amazing to see what can be done by skilled craftsman. I am amazed. Thanks for posting this.

ftboomer
Mar 13th, 2004, 05:16 AM
Absolutly Beautiful!! Just outta curiosity, what did you charge for that job (if you don't mind me asking).

How would you recommend I "interview" someone of your caliber before hiring just some joe-schmo outta the phone book?

Thanks and agian, GREAT JOB!

teammgwrs
Mar 13th, 2004, 05:20 AM
guys,

may i ask why you need to put the buffing pad to a sealed plastic when not in use? can you give us the details of the step by step procedure on what you did with the bmw? without the picture for better procedure......thanks :)

Lynn Matthews
Mar 13th, 2004, 10:51 AM
Originally posted by teammgwrs
guys,

may i ask why you need to put the buffing pad to a sealed plastic when not in use?

I buy Ziploc bags in bulk at Costco. I send one box of each size out to the garage so they are readily accessible. Putting your pads in a Ziploc bags is great way to keep them from getting dirty and reduces the chance of picking up a dirt particle that could end up scratching your paint.:)

Lynn

Teak
Mar 13th, 2004, 05:14 PM
Originally posted by teammgwrs
guys,

may i ask why you need to put the buffing pad to a sealed plastic when not in use?

Also, makes finding a dedicated pad easier and makes for a more organized appearence when stored.

Eric

Superior Shine
Mar 13th, 2004, 08:51 PM
Originally posted by ftboomer
Absolutly Beautiful!! Just outta curiosity, what did you charge for that job (if you don't mind me asking).

How would you recommend I "interview" someone of your caliber before hiring just some joe-schmo outta the phone book?

Thanks and agian, GREAT JOB!

I would recommend doing what you would do if you’re looking for a competent person to do any job for you. Get references and check them, find out everything you can about detailing and see if what they say makes since, try to get a look at the last couple of cars they detailed.

Superior Shine
Mar 13th, 2004, 09:01 PM
Originally posted by AutoNova
I really like your set-up with your van and all, can you post a few pictures of the interior and the equipment you use? As someone wanting to get into the mobile side of the business I would like to see your set-up and get an idea of what the van and extras cost you?

I will see if I can remember to post some pics of the van.

madtremor
Mar 13th, 2004, 09:46 PM
Absolutely an incredible job. I am throughly impressed. I hope with enough practice I will be able to tackle wet sanding and master the rotary. I saw you posted the before pics on Autopia(I think) and was hoping to see the after pictures.

hvyduty2500
Mar 17th, 2004, 09:43 AM
Originally posted by Superior Shine
http://www.superiorshine.com/DETAILING%20050.jpg

I used #85 diamond cut with a wool CUTTING pad to remove the sanding marks. I followed that with DACP and a wool POLISHING pad. Then DACP with w-7009 (i think thats the part number) maroon pad.


Did you use these products on the whole car or just the sanded spots?

Also do you think this outcome can be achieved with a porter cable 7424?

Mike Phillips
Mar 17th, 2004, 10:26 AM
Originally posted by hvyduty2500
Did you use these products on the whole car or just the sanded spots?

Also do you think this outcome can be achieved with a porter cable 7424?

I can't speak for Superior Shine and answer your first question, but I'll take a guess that he only used the wool pad and the #85 Diamond Cut Compound for removing his sanding marks. The over all finish on this car looks much too nice to use these types of aggressive products over the rest of the finish.

As for your second question, the answer is no. The Porter Cable Dual Action polisher is popular because it's easy to use and is pretty much fail safe, (fool-proof). That is, it's pretty hard to do any damage or instill swirls with the PC. The reason for this is because the PC Oscillates versus rotates like the rotary buffer.

This oscillating action is gentle to the finish. It is this gentle polishing action that makes the PC safe and easy to use, it is also the reason it will not remove sanding marks from automotive finishes, it is too safe and too gentle.

It’s kind of like a double edged sword so to speak.

Does that make sense?

Mike

butchdave
Mar 17th, 2004, 12:34 PM
Originally posted by Mike Phillips
This oscillating action is gentle to the finish. It is this gentle polishing action that makes the PC safe and easy to use, it is also the reason it will not remove sanding marks from automotive finishes, it is too safe and too gentle.

Does that make sense?


Actually Mike, no it doesn't :)

The PC is really a sander - with the right abrasives, it will take the car back to metal in seconds - so can you explain again?

Mike Phillips
Mar 17th, 2004, 01:12 PM
Total Topics: 398 - Total Posts: 1725


Originally posted by butchdave
Actually Mike, no it doesn't :)

The PC is really a sander - with the right abrasives, it will take the car back to metal in seconds - so can you explain again?

Your right butchdave, but the goal is to make the paint look good, not take the car back to metal in seconds.

You can wet sand defects out of the finish of your car, then put a sanding disk on your PC and replace your sanding marks with bare metal, but this defeats the purpose of polishing your paint.

Using the PC with a sanding disk is a great way to prepare a car for paint, but not polish paint. If fact, each and every day body shop technicians remove paint down to the bare metal using an air powered D.A. sander to prepare cars for paint. That is very different than using a dual action polisher to remove defects, in this case sanding marks, in a controlled process, in an effort to leave as much paint as possible on the car while at the same time leaving behind a defect-free surface.

What Superior Shine did was to carefully sand out some defects, then carefully buff out his sanding marks. The goal was to remove the defects and leave behind a flawless finish. Which, I think he successfully did as shown by his pictures.

What I was trying to explain was that because the porter cable dual action polisher has a drastically less aggressive movement, or polishing-action when used on an automotive finish, it is not a realistic way to expect to remove sanding marks and, this is key, leave behind a high gloss finish.

Does that make sense? :D

Mike

butchdave
Mar 17th, 2004, 01:23 PM
Mike,

Thats a bit clearer I think. So what I think you are saying is that with a given abrasive and a given amount of effort, the PC will have a more gentle effect.

So as I understand it - its not that you can't remove sanding marks by PC, its that its not the most effective way of doing it.

Is that it? Thanks for your patience!

Mike Phillips
Mar 17th, 2004, 01:58 PM
Originally posted by butchdave
Mike,

That’s a bit clearer I think. So what I think you are saying is that with a given abrasive and a given amount of effort, the PC will have a more gentle effect.

No, not exactly. The PC when compared to a rotary buffer like Superior Shine used, will always have a more gentle action. Depending on what type of pad, or in the case of your above question, a sanding disc, it will or will not be less or more aggressive.

The action of a PC is one of Jiggling for lack of a better term.

The action of a Rotary Buffer is of a powerful, spinning or rotating action that cannot be easily stopped and generates a lot force depending on what pad and product your using.


So as I understand it - its not that you can't remove sanding marks by PC, its that its not the most effective way of doing it.

Is that it? Thanks for your patience!

That's correct! In order to remove a defect, like a scratch, you must remove the paint surrounding the defect until the surround areas are equal to or level with the lowest depth of the scratch. Depending on how deep the scratch is, this can mean removing quite a bit of paint. (If it's a deep scratch). That’s where a discussion on film build or paint thickness comes into play.

I just posted some information on the capabilities of a dual action polisher here,

http://www.meguiarsonline.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=294

Suffice to say, there is a limit to how deep of a defect the porter cable dual action polisher can remove while still leaving behind a clear and glossy finish.

Mike

wetwillysmobile
Mar 17th, 2004, 02:39 PM
Hey Joe great job. I've come to expect nothing less from you, and I do appreciate you sharing some of your secrets with me awhile back. They have made a huge difference in the amount of work required.

Thanks

Superior Shine
Mar 17th, 2004, 03:30 PM
Mike you answered that perfect.

I used a rotory over the whole car with Megs maroon pad. The sanding areas are the only areas that got the wool pad.

I did try the maroon pad on the sanding marks first but this 745 has very hard paint and I was generating TOO much heat with it.

Willy-thank you for the kind words.

hvyduty2500
Mar 18th, 2004, 08:21 AM
Originally posted by Mike Phillips
I can't speak for Superior Shine and answer your first question, but I'll take a guess that he only used the wool pad and the #85 Diamond Cut Compound for removing his sanding marks. The over all finish on this car looks much too nice to use these types of aggressive products over the rest of the finish.

As for your second question, the answer is no. The Porter Cable Dual Action polisher is popular because it's easy to use and is pretty much fail safe, (fool-proof). That is, it's pretty hard to do any damage or instill swirls with the PC. The reason for this is because the PC Oscillates versus rotates like the rotary buffer.

This oscillating action is gentle to the finish. It is this gentle polishing action that makes the PC safe and easy to use, it is also the reason it will not remove sanding marks from automotive finishes, it is too safe and too gentle.

It’s kind of like a double edged sword so to speak.

Does that make sense?

Mike


Yes Mike that i can understand, but I think I asked the wrong question.

Over and above the sanding marks is it possible to achieve the shine and deepness produced here with the PC and the steps following the #85?

Thanks for all of your input!

mopar
Mar 20th, 2004, 09:11 PM
that looks amazing

bigjason
May 10th, 2004, 02:31 PM
Great job!!
How much you charge for this job?

JaguarXJ6
May 10th, 2004, 06:28 PM
Great work and write up! You lead, we follow. 'Nuff said. :bow

Sunny

SolarA853
May 11th, 2004, 06:26 AM
Superior Shine- I'm a noob around here, but I am always blown away at your results! :bounce

Whenever I see a black car you have worked on, it makes me wish I had gotten a black SRT-4 instead of yellow. Keep up the great work, and thanks for sharing.

Mike in AZ

Scottwax
May 16th, 2004, 08:21 PM
Terrific work Joe! You are a true professional! I've done some rotary swirl removal too, courtesy of Moritz BMW in Arlington near me....so much so that I warn all my regulars to make sure they specify the make ready guys don't touch their new cars. I fail to understand how any dealership (even Kia) would allow such horrible work to go on under their own roof.

I haven't done any paint correction at the level you did though with color sanding and major buffing steps. Looks like I need to get some body panels when I get a rotary and not only practice how to attain swirl free results but also to work on my wetsanding skills. I took some paint and body classes years ago, but it has been too long for me to have enough confidence to go wild on a customer's car yet.

Scottwax
May 16th, 2004, 08:29 PM
Joe-forgot to ask. I know the 745s do have some orange peel issues. When you wetsanded just in spots, was it just enough to remove the defects or did it remove orange peel as well? On a car with bad orange peel, I would think spot wetsanding might be noticable...ie, orange peel free areas amid a sea of orange peel.

Comments?

Superior Shine
May 17th, 2004, 06:48 AM
This BMW didnt have bad orange peel.

If it would have, you can sand out the defect then widen the area your sanding to kind of blend the smoothness into the orange peel so it isnt noticable.

KC's
Sep 21st, 2009, 06:04 AM
dear joe

do u know what happnd to yr pics
this is a good write up

would be vry grateful to u

Eddie6th
Sep 21st, 2009, 09:18 AM
No pics,but I know what the reply is.....

Nice work :xyxthumbs

Superior Shine
Sep 21st, 2009, 05:26 PM
This post was my very first write up. I hosted the pics on my old web-site. When I changed web-site all the pics were erased.

KC's
Sep 21st, 2009, 08:47 PM
This post was my very first write up. I hosted the pics on my old web-site. When I changed web-site all the pics were erased.
ok

keep up the good work...i can see from the feed back......u r good in yr detailings

Superior Shine
Jul 29th, 2014, 09:35 PM
This has to be one of the worlds oldest write ups!! Sorry the pics are long gone. I was inspired by Mike Phillips after he did what I consider the first detailing write up ever. I will claim 2nd person to do a write up. Write ups have come a long way since 2004.

Lynn Matthews
Jul 30th, 2014, 06:19 AM
This has to be one of the worlds oldest write ups!! Sorry the pics are long gone. I was inspired by Mike Phillips after he did what I consider the first detailing write up ever. I will claim 2nd person to do a write up. Write ups have come a long way since 2004.

Flash back to the good old days! I still remember writing the rules and the exciting launch of MOL. Oh, and I will never forget the charity auction for Teen Challenge when I sold the very first lab sample bottle of NXT signed by Barry on eBay.

Mike has for sure inspired many and continues to do so...

Michael Stoops
Jul 30th, 2014, 06:59 AM
It's like a Throwback Thursday or a Flashback Friday.... except it's only Wednesday.


Joe, you've been inspiring people on this forum for a very long time with the quality of your work and sense of humor. I'm proud to know you!!

Jarhead0754
Jul 30th, 2014, 08:09 AM
Joe needs to start doing write ups again. He does amazing work but rarely shows it off. Maybe throw a few YouTube videos in too!