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Mike Phillips
Jan 29th, 2009, 04:30 PM
Removing Random Isolated Deeper Scratches - Man vs Machine (http://meguiarsonline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=30153)

The topic of removing deeper scratches comes up on the forum quite often; sometimes the thread goes like this

"I just buffed out my car using a dual action polisher and afterwards I noticed a lot of deeper scratches that didn't come out?

Do I just continue buffing on these deeper scratches to remove them?"

The answer to the above question is usually "no".



Here's why...

When you use a DA Polisher like our G110 with a swirl and scratch remover in most cases the tool, pad and correction chemicals offer enough power to remove all the light swirls and scratches leaving the deep ones behind.

By removing all the zillions of lighter or shallow scratches you clean up and clear up the surface so that now all the remaining deeper defects now show up to your eyes more easily, in fact often times they will stand out like a sore thumb.

This can be more annoying than the original problem you set out to solve that is removing the zillions of light swirls and scratches evenly instilled throughout the finish.

The problem with trying to remove the deeper scratches simply by repeating the machine cleaning step you used for the light swirls and scratches is that the pressure you apply to the machine is spread-out over the entire face of your choice of foam buffing pad and because modern clear coat paints tend to be harder than traditional single stage paints, and because the dual action polisher has a clutch which stops the pad from rotating if too much pressure is applied, removing a random, isolated deeper scratch means removing quite a bit of paint over the section you're working on.

In order to remove the deeper scratches you need to remove all the paint surrounding the scratches until you've leveled the uppermost most portion of the surface with the lowest depths of of the defects you're trying to remove.

While the dual action polisher was effective at removing light or shallow swirls and scratches, it's often times faster to go after random, isolated deeper scratches and other defects by hand instead of using a dual action polisher because with your hand, (which is actually 4 fingers pushing down on the applicator pad because your thumb is on the other side enabling your to grasp the pad between your fingers and thumb), you can exert more pressure to a smaller area.

You're hand won't tend to stop just because you apply more pressure while a dual action polisher will tend to stop rotating when too much pressure is applied as that is the safety feature provided by the clutch that prevents you from instilling swirls or burning through the paint.

Thus when trying to remove deep defects out of your car's paint you can usually do it more effectively and faster by simply falling back on the old fashioned, tried and true method of working by hand with either Meguiar's ScratchX 2.0 or Ultimate Compound.

Then after removing the deeper defect to your expectations or comfort level, (remember paint is thin and sometimes your better off to only improve a deeper scratch making it harder to see than to try to completely remove the deeper scratch and risk rubbing through the clear layer of paint.

The below pictures shows the reduced working area when working by hand and exerting medium pressure to remove swirls and scratches out of a single stage paint.

After applying a paint cleaner by hand to remove swirls and scratches to a car with a red single stage paint job and then turning the applicator over you can see that red pigmented paint accumulated the most where your 4 fingertips pressed down on the applicator pad. You get these same types of results when you're working on a clear coat finish by hand, (with a paint cleaner), except you can't see the accumulation of removed paint because it's clear.

http://archive.meguiarsonline.com/forums/photopost/data/649/FingerPressurePoints.jpg



An experienced detailer and/or enthusiasts knows when to work by machine and when to work by hand for the best results for the task at hand.


:)

Mike Phillips
Jan 29th, 2009, 04:45 PM
RIDS Removers
RIDS = Random Isolated Deeper Scratches

ScratchX 2.0 (http://meguiarsonline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=28333)
http://archive.meguiarsonline.com/forums/photopost/data/809/140_G10307_ScratchX2_0.jpg[/URL]


[URL="http://www.meguiarsdirect.com/detail/MEG+G17216"]Ultimate Compound (http://archive.meguiarsonline.com/forums/photopost/data/809/140_G10307_ScratchX2_0.jpg)
http://www.meguiarsdirect.com/imagesEdp/p93565b.jpg


M105 Ultra Cut Compound (http://www.meguiarsdirect.com/product_detail.asp?T1=MEG+ULTRA+32)
http://www.meguiarsdirect.com/imagesEdp/p84848b.jpg



Soft Foam Applicator
http://archive.meguiarsonline.com/forums/photopost/data/702/X3070_HighTechApplicator.jpg



Supreme Shine Microfiber Polishing Cloths (http://www.meguiarsdirect.com/product_detail.asp?T1=MEG+X2020)
http://archive.meguiarsonline.com/forums/photopost/data/702/3PackSupremeShine.jpg

Tuck91
Jan 29th, 2009, 05:19 PM
Thanks Mike, that was a good read.

these new 2009 products make it a lot easier to remove RIDS.

thanks for the new info

codyBane
Mar 19th, 2009, 09:14 AM
Thanks, is there any difference if there's a bit of rust in the scratch? Do you simply sand the rust off by hand? I've got an old RX-7 that's overdue for some TLC.

Bounty
Apr 3rd, 2009, 06:53 PM
Thanks, is there any difference if there's a bit of rust in the scratch? Do you simply sand the rust off by hand? I've got an old RX-7 that's overdue for some TLC.

If you can see rust in the scratch that means it's down to the bare metal of the panel...meaning the RID has gone through the clearcoat, paint layer, and primer. No amount of buffing or wetsanding will remove it. You may reduce the visibility of the scratch somewhat but won't get rid of it without touch-up paint. :(

Andrew C.
Apr 3rd, 2009, 08:51 PM
Thanks, is there any difference if there's a bit of rust in the scratch? Do you simply sand the rust off by hand? I've got an old RX-7 that's overdue for some TLC.
:eek: Bounty is right, that's into the metal. You need paint to fix that

hmahmed
May 17th, 2009, 10:13 PM
I have a lot of fine swirls and some deeper scratches. Should I get the Ultimate Compound or Scratch X 2.0? Is one of them harder than the other or is it that Ultimate is the always the way to go?
I will appreciate your help greatly :)