Pictures from August 11, 2012 - Saturday Advanced Class

[Michael Stoops]

http://www.meguiarsonline.com/gallery/data/500/2garagelogo1.jpg


Advanced Class - Pictures & Comments
Meguiar's Car Care 201
Saturday August 11, 2012

Another great day of wet sanding and rotary buffing, with a special surprise guest!

Just as we were getting ready to start the class, Barry Meguiar pulls up in his '32 Ford Roadster and asked if it would be OK to interrupt us and say "hi". Would it be OK???? Well of course it would!!! Barry may be the consummate car guy, but he's primarily a people person and loves talking cars and car care with other car guys.
http://archive.meguiarsonline.com/forums/photopost/data/2035/2012_08_11_Advanced_Class_002.JPG

After our usual classroom portion of the day we step outside and get down to some serious work. Since sanding and rotary compounding can remove significant amounts of paint, we want to take some paint thickness readings before we start.
http://archive.meguiarsonline.com/forums/photopost/data/2035/2012_08_11_Advanced_Class_004.JPG

Here we talked about the importance of using the foam interface pad when damp sanding. In this shot, without the interface and using a sanding disc over a body contour you can see how we not only lift the abrasive media off the paint in the low spot, but we also put undo pressure on the high spot. This can quickly lead to sanding through the paint on the high spot.
http://archive.meguiarsonline.com/forums/photopost/data/2035/2012_08_11_Advanced_Class_007.JPG

In this shot we have the foam interface pad in place and we're using a foam backing finishing disc. You can clearly see how the foam allows the media to conform to the contours of the body panel. Now, we still wouldn't recommend just blindly sanding over this area like this, but if you do it this way you have a huge safety margin over not using the interface pad.
http://archive.meguiarsonline.com/forums/photopost/data/2035/2012_08_11_Advanced_Class_008.JPG

OK, let's get starting sanding. We start with 1500 grit finishing media, using our Unigrit finishing discs.
http://archive.meguiarsonline.com/forums/photopost/data/2035/2012_08_11_Advanced_Class_011.JPG

Properly sanded, the surface is very uniform with zero gloss.
http://archive.meguiarsonline.com/forums/photopost/data/2035/2012_08_11_Advanced_Class_032.JPG

Here we've followed up the 1500 grit sanding with 3000 grit and you can start to see the reflection of the overhead lights. That's right, we were still sanding the surface, but we actually increased gloss by sanding. This yields a very uniform and predictable sanding mark that is much easier to remove with the rotary buffer and M105 Ultra Cut Compound. It's also much less invasive to the paint compared to trying to compound out a coarser grit sanding mark.
http://archive.meguiarsonline.com/forums/photopost/data/2035/2012_08_11_Advanced_Class_033.JPG

Of course we want to make sure we have a clean pad to start with, so we cleaned our wool pad in the pad washer.
http://archive.meguiarsonline.com/forums/photopost/data/2035/2012_08_11_Advanced_Class_036.JPG

First step with the buffer is to compound using a wool cutting pad and M105
http://archive.meguiarsonline.com/forums/photopost/data/2035/2012_08_11_Advanced_Class_046.JPG

Don't fight the rotary - you control it, it doesn't control you.
http://archive.meguiarsonline.com/forums/photopost/data/2035/2012_08_11_Advanced_Class_049.JPG

And do NOT run the pad up on edge like this!!! This only leads to buffer swirls (AKA holograms). We repeat - do NOT run your buffer in this attitude.
http://archive.meguiarsonline.com/forums/photopost/data/2035/2012_08_11_Advanced_Class_050.JPG

Wiping off the M105 residue reveals a return to a gloss finish.
http://archive.meguiarsonline.com/forums/photopost/data/2035/2012_08_11_Advanced_Class_051.JPG

But the first pass didn't make the paint perfect. We still have some sanding marks and a bit of buffer swirl, so we need another pass.
http://archive.meguiarsonline.com/forums/photopost/data/2035/2012_08_11_Advanced_Class_052.JPG

Cleaning the wool pad with a pad spur to make sure it remains clear during the compounding process. Do this regularly and the work will go faster and you'll get a better result.
http://archive.meguiarsonline.com/forums/photopost/data/2035/2012_08_11_Advanced_Class_055.JPG

If you're not familiar with using a rotary buffer but are skilled with a DA, you should be able to make the transition easily enough, but you need to keep in mind that everything is amplified when using the rotary. That includes heat, and that can be dangerous. Here we show the escalation of heat on the paint surface with a wool pad. 95F was reached fairly quickly, but that temperature is well within the safe zone.
http://archive.meguiarsonline.com/forums/photopost/data/2035/2012_08_11_Advanced_Class_057.JPG

It didn't take long to bump that up to 117F, however, so you really need to keep an eye on things and not get overly aggressive with this tool.
http://archive.meguiarsonline.com/forums/photopost/data/2035/2012_08_11_Advanced_Class_059.JPG

A foam cutting pad will generate a lot more heat, and much faster, than a wool pad will. Here we hit 133F in just a few seconds.
http://archive.meguiarsonline.com/forums/photopost/data/2035/2012_08_11_Advanced_Class_062.JPG

And a few seconds later we reach 204F on the paint surface! This is extremely dangerous and can do real damage before you know what's happened. You really want to avoid this at all costs.
http://archive.meguiarsonline.com/forums/photopost/data/2035/2012_08_11_Advanced_Class_064.JPG

OK, back to correcting the paint. Here we've moved to a foam finishing pad and M205 Ultra Finishing Polish. Again, you don't need to fight the rotary, just control it. Relax, don't tense up.
http://archive.meguiarsonline.com/forums/photopost/data/2035/2012_08_11_Advanced_Class_080.JPG

Following the demo it's time to turn the students loose and see how they get on with all these processes.
http://archive.meguiarsonline.com/forums/photopost/data/2035/2012_08_11_Advanced_Class_083.JPG

With the sanding done and the first round of compounding with M105 and a wool pad we see some light holograms, but the sanding marks are gone. This is good!
http://archive.meguiarsonline.com/forums/photopost/data/2035/2012_08_11_Advanced_Class_085.JPG

Following with M205 on a foam finishing pad we end up with crystal clear paint. This is awesome!
http://archive.meguiarsonline.com/forums/photopost/data/2035/2012_08_11_Advanced_Class_087.JPG

A clear reflection on his good work!
http://archive.meguiarsonline.com/forums/photopost/data/2035/2012_08_11_Advanced_Class_089.JPG

If you aren't having fun when doing this, you're just doing something wrong!
http://archive.meguiarsonline.com/forums/photopost/data/2035/2012_08_11_Advanced_Class_090.JPG

Finishing off black paint with M205 - beautiful!
http://archive.meguiarsonline.com/forums/photopost/data/2035/2012_08_11_Advanced_Class_094.JPG

Thanks to everyone for coming out on a sweltering Saturday and being so enthusiastic about learning these advanced paint care processes, and a special thanks to Greg for taking such great pictures during the demo!

[kenji815]

big thanks to Mike and Meguiar's for offering the awesome class.
I learned a lot and now is not afraid to tackle rotary buffer now.

[smack]

Wow Mike, I cant believe that one pass with the rotory, wool, and M105 didnt take care of everything. Here at work we use the 3M line of professional polishes and pads and when I do something like that I go to their step two with the gray foam pad and it will pull out the 3000 marks.

[Michael Stoops]

Wow Mike, I cant believe that one pass with the rotory, wool, and M105 didnt take care of everything. Here at work we use the 3M line of professional polishes and pads and when I do something like that I go to their step two with the gray foam pad and it will pull out the 3000 marks.
It's really more a question of the paint on this panel (these poor panels are just beaten on time and time again) and the fact that during the demo/teaching process we also do a bit of "what not to do", as shown in the pix, and that compromises results.

One thing we didn't really show here was a later demo, at the request of one of the students, where we sanded with 3000 grit and then pulled the sanding marks with the DA Microfiber System. That surprised the guys a bit!

[smack]

It's really more a question of the paint on this panel (these poor panels are just beaten on time and time again) and the fact that during the demo/teaching process we also do a bit of "what not to do", as shown in the pix, and that compromises results.

One thing we didn't really show here was a later demo, at the request of one of the students, where we sanded with 3000 grit and then pulled the sanding marks with the DA Microfiber System. That surprised the guys a bit!

I bet the MF system really suprised everyone. What would be the outcome of say UC on a polishing pad with the D/A? Does that combo have any effect on 3000 marks?

[kenji815]

One thing we didn't really show here was a later demo, at the request of one of the students, where we sanded with 3000 grit and then pulled the sanding marks with the DA Microfiber System. That surprised the guys a bit!

That was me !! Mike thanks so much for taking the extra time in showing that to us.
it definitely surprised me what the microfiber system can achieve. I went out and bought a kit after i got home.

[Michael Stoops]

I bet the MF system really suprised everyone. What would be the outcome of say UC on a polishing pad with the D/A? Does that combo have any effect on 3000 marks?
We wouldn't expect UC/polishing pad/DA to give very speedy results, unless the paint was super soft. The DAMF we'd go for in a heartbeat, and a rotary with a wool or foam cutting pad and M105 is a no brainer. But anything less than that is just going to be far too time consuming and frustrating in the vast majority of cases.

[A3*]

Mike,

It was another great class and I thank you for allowing me to attend and take pics. I learned a lot and I gota say, its all about controlling the rotary. Thanks again,
Greg

[truongsean]

Mike,
thanks for teaching the "not to do stuff"! :) I enjoyed and learn a lot from the class. I love how quiet that Flex rotary tool!

Sean

[kenji815]

i went out and picked up a microfiber system and start detailing my BLACK NON METALLIC Lexus LS400.
I have to say i'm 200% impressed. I made 2 pass on the hood and it took away 95% of the hologram and fine scratches left by the previous owner. :doh
I just wish it wasn't so hot lately so i can finish the car and take some pictures.

[kenji815]

here is link a in progress detailing thread with some pictures i took of my LS400.
http://www.meguiarsonline.com/forums/showthread.php?56013-journey-for-perfection-bring-new-life-to-95-Lexus-LS400&p=512309#post512309
i can't wait to finish the entire car and get better pictures.

[SLVRNBLK]

Excellent class. I learned a lot. I now have no fear of wet sanding!