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Mike Phillips
Jul 5th, 2005, 07:43 AM
How To Remove Swirls By Hand (http://meguiarsonline.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=7011)


The below write-up was taken from page three of this Saturday Detailing Class at Meguiar's where approximately 25 people witnessed the products shown below, applied and removed using the correct techniques to remove the gross rotary buffer swirls and restore a swirl free finish by hand.

San Diego Mercedes-Benz club at Meguiar's! (http://www.archive.meguiarsonline.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=5310&perpage=10&pagenumber=3)


After selecting two Mercedes-Benz automobiles to work on, one being Tom's, we broke for a pizza lunch. After everyone had their fill of pizza and something cold to drink, it was time to re-gather in Meguiar's Garage to see what we could do with the gross swirls in Tom's recently painted hood.

http://archive.meguiarsonline.com/gallery/data/500/2MB2HandDemo1.jpg


Often times when the topic of removing swirls is being discussed on our discussion forum, or some other detailing forum, it centers around the dual action polisher, foam buffing pads and somebody's compound or polish. Yet many people don't own a dual action polisher. So here at Meguiar's Garage, we like to show people how to use the what they already own... their hands!

http://archive.meguiarsonline.com/gallery/data/500/2MB2HandDemo2.jpg

Like most detailing enthusiasts, I personally love a challenge, and with Tom's car, I believe most people would agree, his car's finish presents a challenge!

BEFORE - 700 Pixel-wide cropped out section from an un-touched, original photo of rotary buffer swirls in a clear coat finish.


http://archive.meguiarsonline.com/gallery/data/500/2MB2GrossSwirls1jRAW.jpg


Using some painters tape, we taped-off a section of the hood to separate the before and after results. Then, we applied three, well worked in applications of Meguiar's ScratchX (http://www.meguiars.com/store_meguiars/product_detail.cfm?sku=G-103)all applied by hand using Meguiar's High-Tech Applicator Pad (http://meguiars.com/newproducts05/accessoryproduct_page.cfm?SKU=X-3070)

http://meguiars.com/estore/images/product_g103.gif http://www.showcarshine.com/accessories_files/X3070.jpg


http://archive.meguiarsonline.com/gallery/data/500/2MB2HandDemo3.jpg

The secret to removing swirls by hand using Meguiar's ScratchX is all in your technique. You see in order to remove swirls out of your car's finish, you need to remove a little bit of paint. If we we're to look at a horizontal view of what gross rotary buffer swirls look like in the paint, it would look something like the diagram below. In order to remove these below surface defects, (swirls), you need to remove enough paint from the finish to level the upper surface with the *****t depths of the swirls until you've restored the finish to a flat, level surface.

http://archive.meguiarsonline.com/gallery/data/500/2swirlsinpaint.JPG


To do this by hand with ScratchX, you need to,

* Apply to a small section at a time
* First spread the ScratchX evenly over the area you're going to work (before working it in)
* Work the microscopic diminishing abrasives against the finish applying a little passion behind the applicator pad
* Repeat this process with multiple applications after first removing the residue from each application after working it against the finishhttp://archive.meguiarsonline.com/gallery/data/500/2MB2HandDemo4.jpg

Remember that Meguiar's paint cleaners, like ScratchX do not need to dry before removing. Drying adds no benefit. The only Meguiar's paint products that need to dry before removing are Meguiar's waxes.

Technique Tip

The question is often asked,

"Which direction should I move my hand when applying a Meguiar's paint cleaner?"

A common mis-conception, often espoused on other discussion forums, or by some car care product manufactures, is the technique of only rubbing a product in a certain direction to keep all of your scratches going in the same direction.

Meguiar's teaches that if the products you're using are non-abrasive, that is they are not instilling scratches into the finish, as such, it shouldn't matter which direction you move your hand!

If the products you're using are inflicting scratches into your car's finish, the correct thing to do is to stop using the product! Don't try to camouflage the scratches to your eyes by instilling them in straight-lines as determined by the movement of your hand.

ScratchX can be applied using straight-lines or circular motion and for this particular demonstration we used a combination of both.

Removing ScratchX using Meguiar's Supreme Shine Microfiber (http://meguiars.com/newproducts05/accessoryproduct_page.cfm?SKU=X-2010) after working the product against the finish until the product has broken down, turned somewhat clear and begun to dissipate.

http://archive.meguiarsonline.com/gallery/data/500/2MB2HandDemo5.jpg


At Meguiar's Saturday Detailing 101 classes, we go through a power point presentation that covers a wide spectrum of detailing topics, one of which is Meguiar's 5-Step Paint Care Cycle (http://www.meguiarsonline.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=2409), which includes;

Step 1 Wash
Step 2 Clean
Step 3 Polish
Step 4 Protect
Step 5 MaintainAfter cleaning the paint with a paint cleaner like ScratchX, we then apply a pure polish, in this case, Deep Crystal Polish (http://www.meguiars.com/store_meguiars/product_detail.cfm?sku=A-21) which is a non-abrasive pure polish.

http://archive.meguiarsonline.com/gallery/data/500/2MB2HandDemo6.jpg

In Meguiar's line, we offer two types of polishes, cleaner/polishes, which contain a diminishing abrasive, and pure polishes, which are completely non-abrasive and are used solely for the purpose of creating brilliant gloss. Deep Crystal Polish is a pure polish.

http://meguiars.com/estore/images/product_a21.gif

The way you apply a pure polish is akin to applying a skin lotion to your skin. That is you apply the polish to a small section at a time, work the product in thoroughly.

http://archive.meguiarsonline.com/gallery/data/500/2MB2HandDemo7.jpg

After thoroughly, (but gently with care and passion), remove any excess polish with a clean, soft premium quality microfiber polishing cloth or 100% cotton towel.

http://archive.meguiarsonline.com/gallery/data/500/2MB2HandDemo8.jpg

Like ScratchX a paint cleaner, it is not necessary to let a pure polish like Deep Crystal Polish dry before removing it. Allowing a polish to dry will not add anything beneficial to the process, so after you work it in well, go a head and remove it.


At this point, we have cleaned and polished the finish. The cleaning step removed the swirls and the polishing step restored optical clarity, depth, reflectivity, richness of color and brilliant gloss. Next we're going to apply a coating of Meguiar's new NXT Generation Tech Wax Paste (http://meguiars.com/newproducts05/nxtproduct_page.cfm?SKU=G-12711)

http://www.showcarshine.com/product_files/G12711.jpg

NXT Generation Tech Wax Paste is identical to NXT Generation Tech Wax Liquid except that it comes in a paste form. There are two types of paste waxes, the difference is in their consistency. The practical application difference is in how you remove them from the can and then apply them.

With a cleaner/wax (paste), like Meguiar's A12 Meguiar's Cleaner/Wax (http://www.meguiars.com/store_meguiars/product_detail.cfm?sku=A-12) you can scoop out a small amount and with your applicator pad and then apply it to the finish and work it in.

http://archive.meguiarsonline.com/gallery/data/500/2Cleanerwax.gif

With paste waxes like Gold Class Clear Coat Wax Paste, M26 Hi Tech Yellow Wax, and NXT Generation Tech Wax Paste, instead of scooping wax out of the can, you can twist, or spin your wax applicator against the wax while it's in the can and this little bit of agitation will help to liquefy the wax and enable it to seep, or penetrate into your applicator pad whereupon making it easier to apply to the finish.

http://archive.meguiarsonline.com/gallery/data/500/2MB2HandDemo9.jpg

http://archive.meguiarsonline.com/gallery/data/500/2spinwaxpad.jpg

Paste waxes like NXT Tech Generation Wax offer good gliding action and tend to apply very easy. Remember a little bit goes a long ways and it's important to try to apply a uniform, thin coating.



After applying the Tech Wax Paste and allowing it to dry, we removed it using a Supreme Shine Microfiber polishing cloth and the Tom backed his Mercedes-Benz out into the sun where everyone could look at the results and see with their own two eyes what can be accomplished by hand with the right products and the correct techniques.

http://archive.meguiarsonline.com/gallery/data/500/2MB2HandDemo10.jpg

http://archive.meguiarsonline.com/gallery/data/500/2MB2HandDemo11.jpg

http://archive.meguiarsonline.com/gallery/data/500/2MB2HandDemo12.jpg

Here's the owner Tom inspecting closely!

http://archive.meguiarsonline.com/gallery/data/500/2MB2HandDemo13.jpg

And here I am capturing the results with our Sony Digital which does an excellent job of capture swirls in the sun.

http://archive.meguiarsonline.com/gallery/data/500/2MB2HandDemo14.jpg


Before

http://archive.meguiarsonline.com/gallery/data/500/2MB2GrossSwirls1jRAW-med.jpg

After

http://archive.meguiarsonline.com/gallery/data/500/2MB2GrossSwirls1k.jpg

http://archive.meguiarsonline.com/gallery/data/500/2MB2GrossSwirls1l.jpg


http://archive.meguiarsonline.com/gallery/data/500/2MB2GrossSwirls1m.jpg

http://archive.meguiarsonline.com/gallery/data/500/2MB2GrossSwirls1n.jpg

http://archive.meguiarsonline.com/gallery/data/500/2MB2GrossSwirls1o.jpg

http://archive.meguiarsonline.com/gallery/data/500/2MB2GrossSwirls1p.jpg

http://archive.meguiarsonline.com/gallery/data/500/2MB2GrossSwirls1q.jpg

Perfect? No.

dramatically improved? Yes!

Most importantly, we fixed by hand what someone else inflicted with a rotary buffer.

Meguiar's products, applied and removed using the correct techniques will outperform the competition hands down and give your car a swirl-free show car shine!

ACE
Jun 17th, 2006, 05:58 AM
Mike...you the man. Thanks for the info on removing swirls. I have a 2000 300m inferno red chrysler that had some issurs with swirls and minor scratches. I did the deep crystal system with the gold class wax (liquid) and it was impressive. The tip of putting 3 apps of scratchX will probably take my car to another level.

Thanks

ZemanM
Jun 19th, 2006, 07:15 AM
Scratch-X worked a miracle on my black 2004 Grand Prix that I bought (used) last month. The finish had a lot of swirl marks and it looked like cobwebs. I used Scratch-X and it took out the swirl marks and the fine scratches. I followed up with the Swirl Free Polish and then with NXT Generation wax and the car looks absolutely amazing. I love it when my black car's finish looks wet.

:xyxthumbs :xyxthumbs :xyxthumbs

JerryX
Aug 19th, 2006, 10:49 AM
How often can you used this method? Every month?

Murr1525
Aug 19th, 2006, 09:58 PM
While this is probably best in another thread, the answer is you can do it as often as needed, but if you get swirls that bad every month, you have other issues with your car care routine.

snowflakes
Dec 5th, 2006, 03:19 AM
I have been finding some customers with that problem I have been using the product fast shine and cotton because here I don't find some products of Meguiars unhappily.

hondaprelude98
Jan 9th, 2007, 10:05 AM
DO i have to use the polish and the wax for it too look that good. I used the scratchX and it looks good but not as good as i want it to be

gb387
Jan 9th, 2007, 04:36 PM
DO i have to use the polish and the wax for it too look that good. I used the scratchX and it looks good but not as good as i want it to be


You say it doesn't looks as good as you want it... not enough shine? Still swirls and scratches?

ScratcchX is a cleaner polish and will provide no protection from the environment... so anytime you use ScratchX you need to apply a coat of wax. You can apply ScratchX more than once to help eliminate swirls and scratches.

Mike Phillips
Jan 9th, 2007, 04:58 PM
DO i have to use the polish and the wax for it too look that good. I used the scratchX and it looks good but not as good as i want it to be


Sometimes there's some confusion over the role of a paint cleaner, it's a product meant to remove defects. After using a paint cleaner you always need to re-apply a coat of protection. Polishing is an optional step that you can do after cleaning and before applying a coat of wax.

Jefferson_One
Feb 3rd, 2008, 08:53 PM
Several threads and numerous pictures have no doubt made some believers with the ScratchX product! I have a question/comment:

I'm new, but looking around, I've seen a few instances where ScratchX was done by hand ... and I guess the point was it was done in succession about three to four applications before final waxing. That may be worth pointing out for noobs like me, and may be the ticket.

1.) Would using an Dual-Action (D/A) machine reduce the number of applications needed?

2.) If doing by hand, wouldn't this just be excruciating for an entire vehicle?

3.) You mention to get results you have to remove some paint ... to clarify, is it actually taking the clear off and then the paint, or ... is that a general statement - seems like one would need to re-clear the car.

As a noob, I used it once on my black Benz, and saw little results - by hand ... I am ordering a machine this week cuz all weekend about killed me!

Thanks for making such great products, and for all of the technical advise! In just a few days, I've learned that a pure polish is non-abrasive ... not what I would have thought. A good guy on here told me to go get ScratchX ... so I did!

Thanks for being patient as I hobble along here learning my way around ;)

Michael Stoops
Feb 3rd, 2008, 10:18 PM
1.) Would using an Dual-Action (D/A) machine reduce the number of applications needed? With the new formulation of ScratchX making it machine compatible, yes. But if you're getting a machine you really should step up to something like M80 for even faster results.


2.) If doing by hand, wouldn't this just be excruciating for an entire vehicle?Not to put too fine a point on it...... HECK YEAH!! I can't imagine doing an entire vehicle by hand using ScratchX or any other swirl remover. Ouch.


3.) You mention to get results you have to remove some paint ... to clarify, is it actually taking the clear off and then the paint, or ... is that a general statement - seems like one would need to re-clear the car.While technically any cleaner polish will remove some paint, you are removing such a minuscule amount that you shouldn't worry about it all. With single stage paints you will see the color of the paint transfer to your applicator pads. With clear coat there is also some transfer but since it's clear you can't see it. Clear coat is simply paint with no pigment.


As a noob, I used it once on my black Benz, and saw little results - by hand ... I am ordering a machine this week cuz all weekend about killed me!
If your Benz is fairly new then it most likely was painted with MB's CeramiClear paint - to say this paint is hard is an understatement. ScratchX by hand on this paint is daunting at best.

In general the G110 is a great investment!!

dozer
Mar 31st, 2008, 11:46 AM
this thread made my day

JAC
Apr 16th, 2008, 03:02 PM
This video tutorial helps a lot:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JVxeqntf0eQ

rareyellowbird
Apr 20th, 2008, 07:58 AM
Totally awesome how you provide all this info to help people. I am totally impressed with this site and am glad my friend brought me here.

http://memimage.cardomain.net/member_images/5/web/2633000-2633999/2633760_1.jpg

Orca
Apr 20th, 2008, 12:43 PM
That video helped me a huge amount! Thanks!

I know that technique is the key to getting the best from products and I've not had good results with Scratch X yet. I'll try again with this technique. I have done similar, but did not concentrate and did not break the product down properly. I have read and re-read many Scratch X posts, but this video showed me exactly what I should be doing. Thanks again.

hamada128
Jun 26th, 2008, 12:09 PM
Sorry to bring this old thread back again.
I just wanted to ask, is it ok to use ScratchX to get rid of some water spots and spider webbing then use ColorX then followed by NXT paste wax??
thanks

Murr1525
Jun 26th, 2008, 12:13 PM
Yes, you could do that.

halim_p
Jun 30th, 2008, 08:14 AM
mike, i have done those steps, but when the other two days , i wash my car with a water only and wipe it, the swirl is coming back. do you have any idea why it is happened? do I made something wrong? thanks. liang

Mike Phillips
Jun 30th, 2008, 08:23 AM
This video tutorial helps a lot:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JVxeqntf0eQ


Looks like the video has been taken down... here's the message posted in its place

This video is no longer available due to a copyright claim by a third party.



mike, i have done those steps, but when the other two days , i wash my car with a water only and wipe it, the swirl is coming back. do you have any idea why it is happened? do I made something wrong? thanks. liang

If the swirls are coming back this means they're not actually being removed or they are somehow being instilled again.

Can you take a before and after picture?

How to capture pictures of swirls in your car's paint (http://meguiarsonline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=13318)


Read through this and make sure you're not making any of the common mistakes like trying to tackle too large of an area at one time or moving the polisher quickly over the paint or not pushing down hard enough etc.


Tips & Techniques for using the G110, G100, G220 and the PC Dual Action Polisher (http://meguiarsonline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=20874)
(These are all similar tools)


:)

gasti_ako
Jul 6th, 2008, 04:32 AM
great thread

92mr2
Jul 24th, 2008, 09:35 AM
HI,

Your not the only one hobbling along here. My current project is a '99 Lexus...black and in need of work on the finish.

I began using scratch X a couple of weeks ago by hand! It's pretty much a panel an evening....3 to 4 applications, really working it in each time. I could not do the whole car in one sitting, who could. I think patience is the name of the game. Yeah the panels stick out a little but if I'm asked about it...it gives me a chance to talk about MeGuires and scratch X.:chuckle1.


Bob

pwaug
Jul 24th, 2008, 09:55 AM
[quote=92mr2;232407]HI,

Your not the only one hobbling along here. My current project is a '99 Lexus...black and in need of work on the finish.

I began using scratch X a couple of weeks ago by hand! It's pretty much a panel an evening....3 to 4 applications, really working it in each time. I could not do the whole car in one sitting, who could. I think patience is the name of the game. Yeah the panels stick out a little but if I'm asked about it...it gives me a chance to talk about MeGuires and scratch X.:chuckle1.

You should try M105 by hand-I'll bet you could cut your applications in half. I did a 11 year old Escort with one application of M105 and one coat of ColorX applied aggressively and it came out great.

superbogel
Aug 26th, 2008, 09:44 PM
can color x be used to remove swirls too other than scratch x??

Murr1525
Aug 26th, 2008, 09:49 PM
ColorX is going to be milder.... So you would get better results with ScratchX, and even better results with #105.

Mike Phillips
Aug 27th, 2008, 07:20 AM
can color x be used to remove swirls too other than scratch x??


By looking at your posting history, you've posted this question to multiple threads.

PLEASE start your own thread for questions about detailing or just stick with the thread you started here on your question.

How to use ColorX (http://meguiarsonline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=26694)

Also a friendly tip, ColorX is one word, not two as in Color x

Thank you.

:idea:

DiZzyBonne
Sep 9th, 2008, 11:24 AM
I just had my hood and bumper painted, but the body shop left a TON of holograms! Seeing as ScratchX removes some paint, and I need to apply wax after, how long should I wait before using the product? Also, how hard do I need to apply the pad, and how long will a hood roughly take me so I know I'm not speeding through it? Thanks!

Mike Phillips
Sep 9th, 2008, 11:40 AM
I just had my hood and bumper painted, but the body shop left a TON of holograms! Seeing as ScratchX removes some paint, and I need to apply wax after, how long should I wait before using the product? Thanks!

For a question like this it's best if you start your own thread...

I'll move your post and create a new thread for you.

:scratchhead1

DiZzyBonne
Sep 9th, 2008, 11:40 AM
Haha, ok thanks :D.

Mike Phillips
Sep 9th, 2008, 11:43 AM
Haha, ok thanks :D.

Here's your thread...

http://meguiarsonline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=27046 (http://meguiarsonline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=27046)

We keep pictures thaht show new members how to start their own thread on the bottom of the forum homepage here,

http://meguiarsonline.com/


If you want to start a new thread, then click to the appropriate forum by clicking here (http://meguiarsonline.com/forums/index.php) and selecting the forum that best describes what your topic will be about and then look for the button on the left hand side of the page that says, New Thread and click on it. You'll see a place to type in your Subject and below that a message box that you can type your message into. After you're finished with your message, click on the Submit New Thread button and your message will be posted to the forum.


http://archive.meguiarsonline.com/forums/photopost/data/500/StartingAnewThreadsmall.jpg

vish@dat
Oct 30th, 2008, 04:25 PM
awesome thats amazing!

aprevo15
Dec 11th, 2008, 09:37 PM
awesome write up. will be trying this out this weekend.

this is what i am planning.

1. wash the car.
2. clay using the meguiars clay kit.
3. scratchx
4. deep crystal polish
5. 2.0 nxt paste wax

i don't have a orbital polisher so i will try it out by hand to see if i can get the results like in the pictures. everyday i regret buying a black car but hopefully after this weekend that will change.

if i am missing something then some suggestions would be great. thanks in advance and this forum rocks!!!

Nappers
Dec 11th, 2008, 10:29 PM
Looks like a great start.

If you run into a wall, start a new thread and give us a shout :xyxthumbs.

We'll help you get your car shiny.

Murr1525
Dec 12th, 2008, 06:18 AM
ScratchXing an entire car in one day *****... dont try to do too much at once if you have a lot of swirls to remove.

LEXUS300T
Dec 25th, 2008, 11:55 PM
I will try it tomorrow and I see if it works.

Also, do i have to wash the car with wax before?

dpardo
Dec 29th, 2008, 08:29 AM
I will try it tomorrow and I see if it works.

Also, do i have to wash the car with wax before?


If you're going to use ScratchX, you should definitely wash your car beforehand as you want to avoid scratching your car with any dirt/gunk that may be on the paint.

Waxing prior to using ScratchX is neither required nor recommended as the ScratchX will remove any wax from the paint.

After using ScratchX, then you will need to apply wax to protect the paint.

Mike Phillips
Dec 29th, 2008, 09:48 AM
Also, do i have to wash the car with wax before?


Just to note, just use a normal car wash when washing your car, there are some car washes that state they have a built in wax but you don't have to use a wash like this when you're getting ready to use a paint cleaner as the paint cleaner will remove everything off the surface.

When using a paint cleaner, only work a small section at a time, about 16" square or so, spread the product out, work it against the paint and then wipe the residue off and move on to a new section and repeat until you've finished a panel and/or went all the way around the car.

You don't let a paint cleaner dry, only waxes need to dry.

:)

LEXUS300T
Jan 3rd, 2009, 11:27 AM
oh so basically when your applying scratchx you dont need to wait a couple of seconds or anything like that? just wipe it as soon as you apply it?

Mike Phillips
Jan 3rd, 2009, 11:41 PM
oh so basically when your applying scratchx you dont need to wait a couple of seconds or anything like that? just wipe it as soon as you apply it?

You don't let any compound, paint cleaner, cleaner/polish or pure polish dry, in the Meguiar's line the only products that need to dry and should be allowed to dry are our waxes.

Because this is a topic that comes up often, there's a thread that addresses this in detail in our Hot Topics (http://meguiarsonline.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=80) forum group>

What it means to remove a scratch out of anything... (http://meguiarsonline.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=7228)



As far as your questions comment about



just wipe it as soon as you apply it?


If you're trying to remove any kind of below surface defect like swirls and scratches, then you need to work the product over and against the surface as you're trying to remove some paint. You can't just simply wipe it on and wipe it off and somehow miraculously it dissolves and remove paint without your help. That's now how defects are removed out of automotive finishes.

Check this thread out,

Which products need to dry before removing? (http://meguiarsonline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=12031)


And my comments in this thread,
http://meguiarsonline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=29410&page=2


:)

Scotty89
Jul 21st, 2009, 05:04 PM
fantastic thread! thanks for the very helpful information Mike :)

Brad777
Aug 27th, 2009, 05:40 AM
With the new formulation of ScratchX making it machine compatible, yes. But if you're getting a machine you really should step up to something like M80 for even faster results.

Not to put too fine a point on it...... HECK YEAH!! I can't imagine doing an entire vehicle by hand using ScratchX or any other swirl remover. Ouch.

While technically any cleaner polish will remove some paint, you are removing such a minuscule amount that you shouldn't worry about it all. With single stage paints you will see the color of the paint transfer to your applicator pads. With clear coat there is also some transfer but since it's clear you can't see it. Clear coat is simply paint with no pigment.

If your Benz is fairly new then it most likely was painted with MB's CeramiClear paint - to say this paint is hard is an understatement. ScratchX by hand on this paint is daunting at best.

In general the G110 is a great investment!!


For those who haven't used M80, I'd highly recommend that you try it. My most recent use was on my 2000 Honda Accord (Blue). I wanted to do a nice job on it to prepare it for our harsh, salty Utah winter season. I first washed and dried the car. Then applied M80 with a rotary and yellow soft buff to clean it up. Then applied a coat of M7 to restore gloss and depth, followed by MXT 2.0. Both the M7 and NXT were applied by hand. The results were outstanding. Only the deepest of scratches still exist...I'll take care of those in the Spring.

Thanks to Meguiars for providing us all with outstanding cleaner and wax options for our needs. Thanks to Mike and all the members for sharing your experiences and photos.

Brad
Bluffdale, Utah

Ced
Jul 8th, 2011, 11:58 PM
Can you apply ScratchX with a waxer/buffer?

Murr1525
Jul 9th, 2011, 12:05 AM
Yes.

Ced
Jul 9th, 2011, 12:12 AM
To the entire car like a paint cleaner?

Michael Stoops
Jul 11th, 2011, 07:01 AM
ScratchX 2.0 is a paint cleaner, and it's DA compatible. So if you want to work it section by section, wiping off before it dries each time, then you certainly can.

tbird2340
May 20th, 2012, 05:04 AM
Wow, awesome thread.. I just got a new (used) car and I've never been big into detailing.. I didn't even know drying with normal bath towels (which is what I always did) is what causes some of the swirls.. :(

Anywho, I want to take great care of this new car and get all the swirls and water marks out. I bought the new car kit, some scratchx, and the claying kit (I already have the NXT wax)..

I washed, dryed, and clayed my car (claying was surprisingly easy!). Then I tried to remove some scratchx (before I had seen this thread).

I didn't really have any results.. :( I tried again a day later and same thing so I said screw it and put a coat of wax on it (because I wanted to get it waxed and figured the scratchx didn't work)..

Well now after reading this thread I want to give it another shot.. A few questions is since I put the nxt on I'm assuming when I try again I'll just have to re-wax?

Anyone know of a valid link for a video of how to do it? That one that was posted is no longer up..

Thanks much!

rossmeister
May 20th, 2012, 10:53 PM
I'm an owner of a 'semi-new' 2012 White Honda Fit that is close to 9 months old. I've picked up some very minor swirls and scratches (my fault, through improper washing and waxing techniques) and was thinking of polishing them out using Ultimate Polish. I've read several threads/postings where it was advised to start with the least aggressive product and move up to stronger products if needed.

Now herein lies the rub: I don't own a DA polisher and at present cannot afford one, but am saving up for one later. So my only option is to go by hand, using Pinnacle's Polishing Pal kit. For those not familiar with the Polishing Pal, it is, in the most simplest of terms, a "poor man's DA". It is a hand held device, shaped to fit the hand, and has hook-and-loops to firmly attach any variety of 4" pads.

Here's my planned technique: Apply UP using the supplied white pads, wiping off with a good MF, thoroughly remove all residue with a good pre-wax cleaner, then apply wax using the red pads.

I've read responses to this thread stating that polishing by hand is going to be long and tedious, and should be done in stages over several days. Problem is I don't have that much time on my hands. (I work two jobs). So I was going to forgo the polishing step and clay my finish instead. Then use a pre-wax cleaner or paint cleansing lotion and then apply wax. I already have multiple coats of ULW and am concerned with build-up.

What do you think about this?

rossmeister
May 20th, 2012, 11:14 PM
I almost forgot to mention that the reason I'm applying a pre-wax cleaner or paintwork cleanser is to remove the ground in grime that no amount of washing will ever remove. And if there are any left-over wax residues not removed by the claying step, this should totally strip the surface. I'm not looking for perfection at this time. Perfection will come later as I continue to learn more and more about DIY auto detailing.

Michael Stoops
May 21st, 2012, 01:28 PM
Anyone know of a valid link for a video of how to do it? That one that was posted is no longer up..



THIS (http://www.meguiarsonline.com/forums/showthread.php?43209-Meguiar-s-Quik-Tips-Video-Series-Removing-Swirls) should be just what you're looking for.



I'm an owner of a 'semi-new' 2012 White Honda Fit that is close to 9 months old. I've picked up some very minor swirls and scratches (my fault, through improper washing and waxing techniques) and was thinking of polishing them out using Ultimate Polish. I've read several threads/postings where it was advised to start with the least aggressive product and move up to stronger products if needed.

Now herein lies the rub: I don't own a DA polisher and at present cannot afford one, but am saving up for one later. So my only option is to go by hand, using Pinnacle's Polishing Pal kit. For those not familiar with the Polishing Pal, it is, in the most simplest of terms, a "poor man's DA". It is a hand held device, shaped to fit the hand, and has hook-and-loops to firmly attach any variety of 4" pads.

Here's my planned technique: Apply UP using the supplied white pads, wiping off with a good MF, thoroughly remove all residue with a good pre-wax cleaner, then apply wax using the red pads.

I've read responses to this thread stating that polishing by hand is going to be long and tedious, and should be done in stages over several days. Problem is I don't have that much time on my hands. (I work two jobs). So I was going to forgo the polishing step and clay my finish instead. Then use a pre-wax cleaner or paint cleansing lotion and then apply wax. I already have multiple coats of ULW and am concerned with build-up.

What do you think about this?
You've actually got a few things working in your favor here:

Your paint is white so it hides a lot of minor defects that black paint would actually highlight
The Honda Fit is known to have pretty soft or delicate paint, so it's pretty easy to correct with proper technique
The Pinnacle Polishing Pal you've picked up already is going to be a big help - very delicate paint is super easy to mar when working by hand because it's very susceptible to pressure points from your fingertips. Having this little tool should totally eliminate that potential, which is great!

Have a read through The Challenge of Delicate Paint (http://meguiarsonline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=44344) for some tips on dealing with this paint. You may actually find Ultimate Compound to be overly aggressive on this paint and that something lighter like SwirlX or Ultimate Polish actually works better. For that matter, you may find that ColorX alone does an outstanding job, especially since you'll be able to put some energy behind it with the Polishing Pal without fear of marring the surface with pressure points.

zhucehao
May 25th, 2012, 05:53 AM
DO i have to use the polish and the wax for it too look that good. I used the scratchX and it looks good but not as good as i want it to be

Murr1525
May 25th, 2012, 06:18 AM
Well, its not needed. But can help.

What were you working on/fixing? What doesnt look quite as good?

Slidder
Jun 1st, 2012, 03:02 PM
I don't mean this in any negative way, however after seeing the before and after pictures, yes there was a difference. But that's not the type of shine I would expect after all that rubbing. Wouldn't a buffer have worked faster and better?

Andy M.
Jun 1st, 2012, 06:51 PM
I don't mean this in any negative way, however after seeing the before and after pictures, yes there was a difference. But that's not the type of shine I would expect after all that rubbing. Wouldn't a buffer have worked faster and better?

The purpose of the thread was to show you how to remove swirls by hand. To answer your question yes a buffer would have been faster, but as stated in the thread not everyone has one.

Mike Phillips
Jun 4th, 2012, 04:03 AM
Wouldn't a buffer have worked faster and better?



Hi Slidder,

To your question,




"yes". You make the same point I made for years teaching the Saturday 101 Classes here and now in Florida. You ALWAYS get better results by machine versus working by hand because the paints changed and modern clear coat paints are harder than traditional single stage paints and you with your hand can only do so much. The machine never gets tired and moves a buffing pad under pressure at a high OPM rate and together with the right chemicals and techniques even a beginner can create show car results.

I took these pictures and removing swirls by hand is no easy feat, so actually, the results you see are very good. That was the other point made in the class and that was to teach people that didn't own a polisher how to work by hand.

Actually, the amount of ROTARY BUFFER induced swirls removed working only by hand is dramatic.

Before
http://archive.meguiarsonline.com/gallery/data/500/2MB2GrossSwirls1n.jpg


After
http://archive.meguiarsonline.com/gallery/data/500/2MB2GrossSwirls1m.jpg


Of course, after demonstrating how much time and work it takes to remove only a majority of the swirls by hand then demonstrating how easy it is to let the machine do all the work, most of the people going through these classes back then and even today under Mike Stoops leads to the sales of more and more polishers.

In my how-to book, "The art of detailing", I make this point in the first chapter that discusses the history of paint and then again in the chapter the explains how the drive mechanism in tools like the Meguiar's G110v2 work to remove swirls but at the same time are very safe.

You can read more in my articles here,

The Free Floating Spindle Assembly - The Story Behind The Story... by Mike Phillips (http://meguiarsonline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=44841)


Here's an excerpt from the above article,





The practical differences between single stage paints and a clear coat paints
Early 1965 Mustang with single stage paint and a modern Mustang with a basecoat/clear coat finish
http://www.autogeekonline.net/gallery/data/719/1965.jpghttp://www.autogeekonline.net/gallery/data/719/NewMustang.jpg




Frustration with clearcoat paints
Now let me tie this back to why machine polishing has become so much more popular since clear coat paints were introduced.

As more and more cars being manufactured made their way into the market, as car owners, or in other words, do-it-yourselfers, would try the traditional methods of removing defects out of the paint, that is with traditional rubbing and polishing compounds, they would find that most of these products may remove defects but leave their own defects in the paint at the same time.

Not only that, but because generally speaking, modern clear coats are harder than single stage paints, the energy, time and skill required to actually remove defects out of clear coat paints increased dramatically, and in fact increased to the point that many people attempting to remove defects and restore a shine like their car had when they bought it brand new, left most people feeling frustrated and their cars no better off than when they started and often times worse.


Enter the Porter Cable DA Sander
That's right, I said sander! The Porter Cable Dual Action Sander is the tool that became the Tipping Point that was the driving force behind the average person switching from working by hand to working by machine.

Highroller
Aug 3rd, 2012, 06:00 AM
Hello Mike.
I am new into detailing and regularly synthetic wax on monthly basis and wax with gold class weekly but still my cars have developed slight cobweb swirls.
I recently came across this thread but since this procedure and products date back to 2005 i was wondering if you may recommend new products or replace certain products that you have used in this thread to remove swirls.
Thanks

Murr1525
Aug 3rd, 2012, 07:29 AM
Ultimate Compound would be the product for removing swirls by hand these days.

However, be sure to use a good applicator like shown, and similar technique with good even pressure.

Could look at Ult. Polish to follow up with, then something like the Nxt 2.0 wax, Ult. Wax, etc.

ffboy
Aug 3rd, 2012, 06:39 PM
After removing the swirls, you do want to practice proper paint maintenance to avoid or at least minimize those swirls from reoccurring. Swirling can come from anywhere... from improper carwash techniques (which I personally rank highest among swirl producing procedures) to contaminated wax/cleaner applicators.

06hondacivicsi
Aug 16th, 2012, 03:24 PM
So what I would do for a good detail is:?
1. wash car
2. clean with scratch x
3. wax it with meguiars tech wax

ffboy
Aug 16th, 2012, 06:20 PM
I would:
1. Wash car
2. Clay bar
3. Depending on the degree or amount of scratches/swirls on the paint. ScratchX 2.0 will remove deeper scratches and may be better for smaller work areas, for lighter swirls or refining, swirlX or ultimate polish. For faster detailing, Cleaner Wax or ColorX can be used, especially if the paint isn't too badly swirled up, it will clean, polish protect in 1 simple step.
4. Wax with NXT 2.0, Ultimate wax or Gold Class, choice of wax is up to you.

fpan
Oct 19th, 2018, 02:32 PM
I have a fine scratches and swirls in my car hood. I want to try to remove them with the ScratchX 2.0 and if it needs and with the Ultimate Compound by hand. I am afraid do not marring the car paint. I read that all are the technick. How much pressure should i use to the pad? What pad of Meguiars to use? The Meguiar's X3070 Soft Foam 4" Applicator Pad or the Meguiars Even Coat Applicator Pad X3080?

Murr1525
Oct 19th, 2018, 02:50 PM
I have a fine scratches and swirls in my car hood. I want to try to remove them with the ScratchX 2.0 and if it needs and with the Ultimate Compound by hand. I am afraid do not marring the car paint. I read that all are the technick. How much pressure should i use to the pad? What pad of Meguiars to use? The Meguiar's X3070 Soft Foam 4" Applicator Pad or the Meguiars Even Coat Applicator Pad X3080?

Well, of course doa test spot, area before doing the whole car to check on things.

But save time, just get the UC.

I would get the foam applicator... And it will take a good but if pressure. The key is keeping the pressure even.

fpan
Oct 20th, 2018, 09:57 AM
Well, of course doa test spot, area before doing the whole car to check on things.

But save time, just get the UC.

I would get the foam applicator... And it will take a good but if pressure. The key is keeping the pressure even.
Thank you Murr1525. I will take the UC with the foam applicator. :bigups