how can i know when the compound break down

[zerolam]

So sorry that i have a lot of questions.

During polishing by DA, how can i know the compound is broken down.

[Ticman]

Re: how can i know when the compound break down

When it gets clear/translucent looking. Another good tell is when you wipe it off with a microfiber towel it should come off very easily.

I highly recommend the DVD that Mike did for a beginner using the G100/DA/PC.

Tic

[BlueZero]

Re: how can i know when the compound break down

+1 on the dvd

I learned so much in such a short amount of time watching it. It's worth the money.

[yalerd]

Re: how can i know when the compound break down

+1 on the dvd

I learned so much in such a short amount of time watching it. It's worth the money.

You can observe and see what we are talking about

[PorscheGuy997]

Re: how can i know when the compound break down

Which compound are you using with the DA?

Most DA's (PC included) will not be able to properly work a compound.

[Mike Phillips]

Re: how can i know when the compound break down

Which compound are you using with the DA?

Most DA's (PC included) will not be able to properly work a compound.

Good catch, could be the original poster of this thread just doesn't understand our terminology yet.

At this time the most aggressive product in the Meguiar's line that we recommend for use with a dual action polisher is our M83 DACP

We don't recommend that you use any of our compounds as Chris pointed out the tool is now powerful enough to properly work the diminishing abrasives against the finish to be consistently effective and to consistently produce good results.

As far as your question goes as it relates to our cleaner/polishes, which can all be used with a DA Polisher, you want to work the product usually as long as you can but without going to a dry buff.

There's a diagram and some instructions here,
Using the G-100 to remove swirls with the Professional Line


And if you haven't already, please read this,
Meguiar's 5-Step Paint Care Cycle


These two threads as well as every thread in the Information Station will bring you up to speed with everyone else.

Please invest a little time reading the above two threads.

Thank you.

[zerolam]

Re: how can i know when the compound break down

sorry for the confusion of the question.

Actually, my problem is that last time i used #9 ,i have a problem to catch the moment of the #9 breakdown. The product seems get clear very easy, i have a question on my mind that is it broken down already? Hence i polished about 4 mins, however, the residue is very hard to remove. If the product get clear is the sign of the product break down. it only takes 1-2 min, will it be not enough?

P.S. i am going to buy the DVD, but my problem is the shipping rate is expensive than the DVD. i'm asking my friends who will join me to share the shipping rate. If i can order it here will be great because i can buy products in the same order. i cannot find meguiar's products in the site of DVD.

[Mike Phillips]

Re: how can i know when the compound break down

sorry for the confusion of the question.

Actually, my problem is that last time i used #9 ,i have a problem to catch the moment of the #9 breakdown.

The product seems get clear very easy, i have a question on my mind that is it broken down already?

Okay, thanks for clarifying, the title of your thread uses the word,

Compound

And the product you're talking about is a dramatically, dramatically, dramatically less aggressive product we call a cleaner/polish and out of our 4 cleaner/polishes this is the least aggressive.

#9 Swirl Remover is a very, very gentle cleaner/polish, feel some between your fingers and feel how smooth and creamy it is?

Can you feel anything gritty or abrasive at all?

(The answer is no)

A few passes in a couple directions as shown in the below diagram, probably around a minute's worth of buffing and you're done.

With some firm pressure on the head of the polisher at the 4.0 to 5.0 setting on the PC and the light diminishing abrasive will have broken down.

Hence i polished about 4 mins, however, the residue is very hard to remove. If the product get clear is the sign of the product break down. it only takes 1-2 min, will it be not enough?

The hard wipe-off is a good sign you buffed it too long and it probably became gummy and dried up on you.
Ouch!

Whether the cleaning ability of #9 is enough or not depends upon three things,

1. How deep the defects are that you're trying remove
2. How hard the paint is
3. You're skill level and ability to use the right technique when using a DA polisher.


Being the most gentle cleaner/polish we offer you shouldn't get your hopes up if you're trying to remove anything other than very light swirls and scratches.

We listed most of the reasons people run into problems in this thread.

Tips & Techniques for using the G100/PC Dual Action Polisher

After teaching hundreds of classes here at Meguiar's, there are some common mistakes most people make when trying to remove swirls and scratches with a dual action polisher. Most of them have to do with technique.

Here's a list of the most common problems

1. Trying to work too large of an area at one time
2. Move the polisher too fast over the surface
3. Too low of speed setting for removing swirls
4. Too little pressure on the head of the unit
5. Too much pressure on the head of the unit so the pad quits rotating
6. Not keeping the pad flat while working your product
7. Too much product, too little product
8. Not cleaning the pad often enough

Here's a list of the solutions in matching order,

1. Shrink your work area down, the harder the paint the smaller the area you can work. The average area should be and average of about 16" by 16" up to 20" by 20" or so. You have to do some experimenting, (called a Test Spot), to find out how easy or how hard the defects are coming out of your car's paint system and then adjust your work area to the results of your Test Spot.
2. For removing defects out of the paint you want to use what we call a Slow Arm Speed. It's really easy to move the polisher too quickly because the sound of the motor spinning fast has a psychological effect to for some reason want to make people move the polisher fast. Also the way most people think is that, "If I move the polisher quickly, I'll get done faster", but it doesn't work that way.
3. When first starting out many people are scared of burning or swirling their paint, so they take the safe route of running the polisher at too low of a speed setting, again... this won't work. The action of the polisher is already g-e-n-t-l-e, you need the speed and specifically the pad rotating over the paint as well as the combination of time, (slow arm speed), together with the diminishing abrasives, the foam type, and the pressure to remove small particles of paint which is how your remove below surface defects like swirls or scratches. It's a leveling process that's somewhat difficult because the tool is safe/gentle while in most cases, modern clear coat paints are harder than traditional single stage paints and this makes them hard to work on. This is also why people get frustrated, they don't understand paint technology, all they know is their paint swirls easy and getting the swirls out is difficult and thus frustrating.
4. For the same reason as stated in #3, people are scared, or perhaps a better word is apprehensive, to apply too much pressure and the result of too little pressure is no paint is removed thus no swirls are removed.
5. Just the opposite of item #4, people think that by pushing harder on the polisher they can work faster and be more aggressive, but the truth is the clutch in the tool is a safety mechanism to prevent burning and will cause the pad to stop rotating, thus less cleaning or abrading action and once in a while this will lead a person to then post on the forum something like this, "Hey my pad doesn't rotate". There needs to be a balance of enough pressure to remove defects and keep the pad rotating but yet not too much pressure as to stop the rotating action. This balance is affected by a lot of things, things like type of chemical, some chemicals provide more lubrication and the pad will spin easier, curved surfaces or any raise in body lines will tend to stop the pad from rotating. This is where experience on how to address these areas comes into play or you do the best you can and move on. It's not a perfect tool, nor a perfect system, but it's almost always better than working/cleaning by hand.
6. Applying pressure in such a way as to put too much pressure to one side of the pad will cause it to stop rotating and thus decrease cleaning ability.
7. Too much product over lubricates the surface and this won't allow the diminishing abrasives to do their job plus it will increase the potential for messy splatter as well as cause pad saturation. Too little product will keep the pad from rotating due to no lubrication and there won't be enough diminishing abrasives to do any work. Again it's a balance that comes with experience, or another way of saying this would be it's a balance that comes with hours of buffing out a car to learn what to do and what not to do. Information like what you're reading here is just an edge to decrease your learning curve. Hope this is helping.
8. Most people don't clean their pad often enough and most of the time the reason for this is because they don't know they're supposed to clean their pad often and they don't know how to clean their pad. Again, that's why this forum is here to help you with both of these things. You should clean your pad after every application of product or every other application of product, your choice, most of the time cleaning your pad after every other application of product works pretty well. It enables you to work clean and enables the foam pad, the polisher and the next application of fresh product too all work effectively. How to clean your pad will be addressed below sooner versus later, but not at the time of this posting. (Sorry, I'm behind a keyboard, not a video camera

The first 4 are the most common. Can't tell you how many times we hear a comment like this from someone in the garage after demonstrating the correct technique

"That's what I'm doing wrong"


The dual action polisher is a gentle tool, that's why people like it. People are afraid of machines because they're worried they're going to either instill swirls or burn through the paint. When they learn that this is pretty hard to do with this machine, so after enough research or after watching a demonstration they learn to trust it and try it.

Summary: People like the dual action polisher because it's oscillating action is safe and gentle to the surface.

Now follow me on this...
For the same reason people love the dual action polisher, (it's safe and gentle), a segment of people get frustrated with it because it won't remove all defects all the time. It won't tackle serious or deep defects quickly and easily. It won't always work on really hard paints. So for the same reason people love this tool, they also hate it, they just don't know why. Maybe after reading this post they will understand.


This is the reason this thread is so widely read and you can learn a lot from it if you'll only take the time to read through it.

PC + 83 not "Cutting" it! - The Limits of the Dual Action Polisher


Even the pictures of the paint on the white truck on the first page and the story behind it are powerful and REAL (This writer took them and did the testing with both the G100/PC and the RB).

When the G100/PC with a strong cleaner/polish like M83 and our W-8006 polishing pad doesn't remove the defects to your satisfaction or within an acceptable time limit the answer is not to get more aggressive with a more aggressive pad or chemical or both, the answer is to switch to a more powerful machine like the rotary buffer and or take the car to a Pro who knows how to use a rotary buffer, or learn to live with the defects.

Hope this helps...



p.s.

Please be sure to read the Meguiar's 5-Step Paint Care Cycle as it discusses cleaner/polishes and their purpose.

[zerolam]

Re: how can i know when the compound break down

Really Really Thanks a lot, i will try again in this weekend for my friend's car.