Will M80 remove 2000 Grit wet sand area? Or should I hand apply M105?

[dhahlen]

My car was keyed, but it seems I can probably get 90% of it out with a wet sand and buff.

I have a DA and I am not sure if I should use M80 after I wet sand, as I am not sure if it will remove the marks.

I heard not to use M105 with a DA, but others have... I'm not a pro with the DA, only used it a few times with nice results.

Should I wet sand with 2000 grit, and hand apply the M105, or should I try and remove the 2000 grit scratches with M80 and a DA? Will M80 work?

Thanks,
Darren

[Mike Phillips]

Re: Will M80 remove 2000 Grit wet sand area? Or should I hand apply M105?

Can it be done?

Maybe, depends upon how hard the paint is and what you use for a buffing pad.

The removal of sanding marks is best done with a rotary buffer. For spot repair Meguiar's does not have an official product recommendation or procedure because for most enthusiasts this will end up getting them into more trouble than they can get out of.

Basically, anytime you're using a tool with a clutch, that is when you apply too much pressure the clutch kicks in and the pad stops rotating, then you're going to lose ability to abrade the paint, i.e. remove the sanding marks.

Check out this thread,
Can You Use the PC to Polish-out #2000 Grit Sanding Marks?


You would have better luck using M105 with a DA Polisher and a small diameter pad or just use your hand to remove the sanding marks with M105 and then come back with the M80 and a polishing pad on the DA to restore gloss and clarity.

Check out this thread too...
Removing #2500 grit wet-sanding marks by hand using M105

[Mike Phillips]

Re: Will M80 remove 2000 Grit wet sand area? Or should I hand apply M105?

Just to point out... the first link I posted can be found in Hot Topics and the second link is a Sticky in Wet-Sanding, Color Sanding, Rock Chip Repair


So much good, practical and helpful information in the "Information Station" like these two forum groups and the List 'O Links thread.
Hot Topics
How To Articles

[dhahlen]

Re: Will M80 remove 2000 Grit wet sand area? Or should I hand apply M105?

I know M105 by hand will work fine, but the area is so big I figured I'd just wet sand the whole roof of the car. I would already be wet sanding 30-40% of the roof.

I was hoping to speed up the process using the DA.

[Mike Phillips]

Re: Will M80 remove 2000 Grit wet sand area? Or should I hand apply M105?

Take your DA, apply some product, place it on the hood of your car and push down hard and look to see what happens to the pad rotation.

The reason 99.9% of Professionals use a rotary is because the rotary is a direct drive constant rotating tool with the power to remove a lot of paint quickly.

The DA is not effective at removing paint quickly, that's what everyone loves about it... it's safe!

That said, all paint are different, do yourself and everyone on this forum a favor, go out and sand a section about 3" to 4" square, keep it small, sand in one direction so your sanding marks are all in one direction.

Then as a learning experience, try to remove these sanding marks using only your DA Polisher and M80 Speed Glaze. Keep a watch handy and time how long it takes you to COMPLETELY remove each sanding mark or line in the paint. Making the paint shiny, that is making the surface shiny isn't the same thing as removing 100% of the sanding marks as is Meguiar's standard.

If you can't get them 100% out using your DA polisher you can always get them out by hand using M105

Even if you can get the sanding marks out of a small area using a DA polisher and M80 Speed Glaze, getting 100% of the sanding marks out of the entire roof would be a project I would not sign up for.

A rotary buffer is the correct tool for removing sanding marks.
Your hand is going to be more effective, read all the threads here tagged with the word exert. (How many times have I posted this?)

Look in Popular Tags
http://meguiarsonline.com/forums/tags.php

Click on the word exert and read these threads...
http://meguiarsonline.com/forums/tags.php?tag=exert

On soft paints, with the right pads and chemicals and good technique, (apply as much pressure as possible while keeping the pad rotating), sanding marks can be removed with a DA Polisher. Meguiar's knows this, the problem is there are so many variables involved that the last thing we want to do is to recommend someone do this because if just one of the variables goes wrong you're going to be stuck with sanding marks in a thin, typically hard clear coat and no remedy outside of getting help from someone with EXPERIENCE and someone with a ROTARY BUFFER.

I know I've commented on this once or twice in the pastl...

[Mike Phillips]

Re: Will M80 remove 2000 Grit wet sand area? Or should I hand apply M105?

One more thing....

Is this the FACTORY PAINT?

If so, it's thin, not thick, that means you have less room for error and less room for trying to do something TWICE. Each time you sand and each time you remove sanding marks you remove paint.

See this thread,

http://meguiarsonline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=29480

Besides being thin, factory paint is baked-on at the factory at high temperatures and this tends to make the paint hard. It's always going to be easy to sand the paint, (that means putting scratches into the paint), the tricky part is getting them out.

99.9% of all wet-sanding is done on FRESH PAINT at a body shop within a few days after a car has been painted, not on factory baked-on, thin paint.

Please do a Test Spot and then update this thread with how it turns out. We sincerely hope it's easy to get your sanding marks out with a DA polisher.

[dhahlen]

Re: Will M80 remove 2000 Grit wet sand area? Or should I hand apply M105?

Yeah, this is factory paint.

A very reputable body shop i took it to quoted me at just over $900 to re-do the roof, removing the small dings in the roof as well. There isn't any repainting being done, just wet sanding and polishing.

I figured I'd try the wet sanding myself, save myself $900.... but, like I mentioned, I'm not a pro and I don't want to make it worse. The M105 has no effect on the current scratches, I'd need to sand them down to make any progress.

[Mike Phillips]

Re: Will M80 remove 2000 Grit wet sand area? Or should I hand apply M105?

The M105 has not effect on the current scratches, I'd need to sand them down to make any progress.

There's a HUGE difference between removing RIDS, (Scratches with an unknown depth), and sanding marks, (controlled depth)

Do a test and let us know how it goes...

[dhahlen]

Re: Will M80 remove 2000 Grit wet sand area? Or should I hand apply M105?

Sounds like I'm going to have sore hands. I'll try out a test spot, but I think I should do all the polishing by hand just to be safe.

[Nappers]

Re: Will M80 remove 2000 Grit wet sand area? Or should I hand apply M105?

Sheesh, you thought I would've read it, the below article, that Mike put up is a good reading.

Sorry, thought it was something else.

M105 by hand vs 2500 Grit wetsanding marks

by Bluezero

[dhahlen]

Re: Will M80 remove 2000 Grit wet sand area? Or should I hand apply M105?

Mike, I read your posts on exert as well. It seems I kept mixing up the rotary and the DA. I understand the clutch design, and I am not going to jump into a rotary tool anytime soon.

However, I think I'll try a couple spots with the M80 and the DA, and then we'll move onto M105 by hand. I'll see about taking some before and afters...thanks.

[dhahlen]

Re: Will M80 remove 2000 Grit wet sand area? Or should I hand apply M105?

So, I did a couple of test areas.

Seems M105 has no problem taking out 2000 grit after a few passes of 20-30 seconds each.

I need to wet sand further down, as I could see the gash in the clear coat (so it looked like a white scratch), after I sanded and used M105, the gas was still there, not as significant, and it wasn't white any longer.

This tells me a couple of things...

1.) I need to sand further down
2.) M105 will do the job

Also, I tried M80 first, and it looks like it may work but it will take a bit more elbow grease than the M105.


In this picture, you can see how most of the scratches looked before, right in the center you can see the white gash.

If you look at about 1 o' clock from the scratch, you'll see a faded scratch that blends in with the paint. This is what I was talking about when I said I needed to sand off a bit more... I'd like to buy a paint thickness tester, but don't know where to get one locally.