3000 grit... use #83?

[integraoligist]

'97 Grenalda Pearl Black Acura Integra (never polished or clayed, only washed and waxed (wax every 2 years)

Getting her Show Car ready:
Wash/clay/fill chips in paint/buff off marks and swirls/wax (do i need to seal or anything before i wax?)

plan on filling paint chips and scratch and wetsanding with 3000grit... need something adrasive enough to take off the sandpaper marks and swirl marks... but yet not hurt the clear coat.
and maybe use every 6 months to buff/clean the paint.

I hear #80 is not adrasive enough to take off the sandpaper marks but is "ok" with swirls...

i hear #2 will take out the sandpaper marks, but is TO harsh on the rest of the paint.

So will #83 work on... well EVERYTHING? I dont like the fact that it has Filler Oils in it (i wont know if all the imperfections are actually gone), but then again.... you wont be able to see the imperfections anyway. i dont know.

Thanks all!

[Mike Phillips]

Re: 3000 grit... use #83?

Hi integraoligist,

As this is your first post,

Welcome to Meguiar's Online!

Originally posted by integraoligist
'97 Grenalda Pearl Black Acura Integra (never polished or clayed, only washed and waxed (wax every 2 years)

Getting her Show Car ready:
Wash/clay/fill chips in paint/buff off marks and swirls/wax (do i need to seal or anything before i wax?)

plan on filling paint chips and scratch and wetsanding with 3000grit... need something abrasive enough to take off the sandpaper marks and swirl marks... but yet not hurt the clear coat, and maybe use every 6 months to buff/clean the paint.

I hear #80 is not abrasive enough to take off the sandpaper marks but is "ok" with swirls...

i hear #2 will take out the sandpaper marks, but is TO harsh on the rest of the paint.

So will #83 work on... well EVERYTHING? I dont like the fact that it has Filler Oils in it (i wont know if all the imperfections are actually gone), but then again.... you wont be able to see the imperfections anyway. i dont know.

Thanks all!

Wow! Where did you hear all of this mis-information? Some other detailing discussion forum? Just goes to show how fast bad information travels and how easy it is for people to repeat information without ever verifying whether or not it's accurate.

Be that as it may... let me help you.

Removing sanding marks, even #3000 grit sanding marks is difficult in most cases because in most cases the paint is really hard, thus it will be very difficult your you and your four fingers to rub an applicator with some chemical long enough and hard enough and with the right action to actually remove the sanding marks and restore a scratch-free surface.

The good news is, it can be done. If you're lucky, your car's paint won't be as hard as glass, this will help you to work out defects by hand or with a dual action polisher.

Forget those other products you mentioned, whoever recommended them to you needs to start reading posts over here instead of where they're hanging out on.

The product you want is ScratchX.




Hopefully you haven't already sanded a hundred spots on your car! If you haven't, then try this, take your #3000 grit sanding paper and sand a small inconspicuous area that has the same paint the areas you want to repair have.

Then, try to remove your sanding marks in this inconspicuous area with ScratchX, apply a quarter size drop on to your foam applicator pad and then apply in a back and forth motion across the direction of the sanding marks with passion, rub for 2-3 minutes. You want to rub till the ScratchX looks oily somewhat like Vaseline would look if you were rubbing it on your finish, but don't rub so long that it's gone.

Now wipe off the residue and inspect. Are your sanding marks still there? If so, repeat the process.

Do this up to three times. If after the third time the sanding marks are gone, then you know you can remove your sanding marks and now you can decide if this is something you want to pursue to each of the areas you want to fix.

If the sanding marks are still present, then this tells you either your paint is very hard or your technique is not adequate or both and be thankful you did this in an inconspicuous area.

Besides removing your sanding marks, typically when you do this kind of finessing, if your touch up paint doesn't dry to a real hard state, then all this rubbing on top of it and on the clear coat around it will tend to remove much of the touch up paint, especially if you start to generate some heat.

Been there done that.

Like I say, it can be done, but it tends to be a lot more work than most people ever imagine.

We get these questions every Saturday at our Detailing 101 class and we try to put the focus back on the big picture, which is making the entire car look great, not a little spot the size of a flea, give or take a flea or two.

Noble pursuit, don't want to discourage, you, but do test your choice of product and your process first in an inconspicuous area before attempting to do the the same process where everyone's attention will be focused.

Best of luck...




Using a foam applicator pad, apply some

[integraoligist]

oops, i forgot to mention i have a PC on the way and was planning on using that to buff all the scratches from the sandpaper out (and swirl marks).

do i use the Scratch X just on the Sanded areas... or can i use it over the entire car... to take all the swirl marks and various light scracths out?

[Mike Phillips]

Unless the paint is incredibly soft, your hand will be more effective than the dual action polisher as you hand will exert more pressure to a smaller work area while the dual action polisher will exert even pressure over the entire surface of the foam pad. And if you push to hard on the dual action polisher it will slow down and become in-effective.

Remember in order to remove a scratch, or scratches, you need to remove paint. Removing sanding marks is best done with a rotary buffer as the action of a dual action polisher is too gentle. Here's a clue, the reason why dual action polishers are so popular, is because it's almost impossible to harm the paint with one, and the reason for this is because they are gentle to the finish (as compared to the rotary buffer). Because the are gentle to the finish, they are not effective at removing paint.

Your hand can be more effective at removing paint in a small area than a dual action polisher.

Somewhere on our forum, all of the above has been discussed before, it would take some searching to find however.

[integraoligist]

gotcha,
i just went outside and took a pic. of the part i'm wanting to fix... you can see all the problems in the red... but this pic dosent show how bad they really are:


(Edit: Photo deleted. Any picture over 700 pixels wide is to wide to use on a forum. 600 to 700 pixels wide is as large as anyone should ever post to a forum. -Mike)

the paint and primer was compleley stripped off of it, i dont know what happend because i bought the car with it like this.

i attemped to do a half-assed job touching it up with OEM Touch-up paint (yes using the **** brush it came with, i didnt know any better).

i was planning on taking that paint off, applying a primer (spraypaint) then the Duplicolor color-match paint (spraypaint thats actually almost OEM looking) and a clear spray... then 3000 grit sand and buff.

[Mike Phillips]

Originally posted by integraoligist

i was planning on taking that paint off, applying a primer (spraypaint) then the Duplicolor color-match paint (spraypaint thats actually almost OEM looking) and a clear spray... then 3000 grit sand and buff.

If you can pull this off, my hat is off to you. How hard would it be to remove the component and have it painted by a pro?

Sure sounds like a lot of work but if it's important to you, the least you could do is try, and if you don't succeed, then take it to a pro. If nothing else it will be a learning experience.

Mike

[Mike Phillips]

Re: 3000 grit... use #83?

Originally posted by integraoligist
plan on filling paint chips and scratch and wetsanding with 3000grit... need something adrasive enough to take off the sandpaper marks and swirl marks... but yet not hurt the clear coat.
and maybe use every 6 months to buff/clean the paint.

I hear #80 is not adrasive enough to take off the sandpaper marks but is "ok" with swirls...

i hear #2 will take out the sandpaper marks, but is TO harsh on the rest of the paint.

So will #83 work on... well EVERYTHING? I dont like the fact that it has Filler Oils in it (i wont know if all the imperfections are actually gone), but then again.... you wont be able to see the imperfections anyway. i dont know.

Thanks all!

We're honored you would come here to ask us how to do the really nitty gritty hard stuff... Have the Pro's on Autopia help you with wet sanding, cutting and buffing touch up paint.


1st Show in 1-month. My polished setup: Opinoins/Help?

The above thread has been moved or deleted by the Mods, I wonder what caused that? No matter, here's another one by you with the same theme...

do i need AIO with this setup?


Now I know where you receive all your mis-information...

[Mike Phillips]

Here's a quote from you on Autopia, 8th post down...

do i need AIO with this setup?

Originally posted by integraoligist
thats what i thought about the Scratch X. i can only assume that the Admin. that posted that message wants us to buy the Scratch X because of the $$$ and how much you will actually use.

First of all, if you re-read this thread, you'll note that you didn't tell me you were going to use a dual action polisher until after I recommend ScratchX. In your first post you gave no hint at all you were attempting do remove sanding marks by machine. And just so you know, sanding marks can be removed by hand with ScratchX using the right technique as I have demonstrated countless times at our clinics.


But more importantly, I have never in my life recommended a product to someone to make a sale. I only recommend products to people that will solve their problems.

Take note:

"A professional salesperson solves their customers problem; if you can solve your customer's problem, they will sell themselves on your product or service"

I went to work the first time for Meguiar's at the age of 26 in 1988, it was also the first time I went into sales. I didn't know anything about sales in that I had no experience and no education in this area. In hindsight, this was probably a blessing as I never tried to sell anything. All I have ever done is try to find out what a person's problem is, and then help them to discover the solution.

I live by the philosophy,

"A professional salesperson doesn't sell anything, they only solve problems".

I'm sorry you feel I recommended using ScratchX as only a means to make money.

Good luck sanding down and removing your sanding marks by hand, or with a dual action polisher. There is area multiple threads on this forum where we explain that the dual action polisher is one of the least effective methods for removing sanding marks.

[integraoligist]

i've used the Scratch X before to take out light scratchs, none "fully" came out. I thought i was applying the product wrong so i came to the autopia site and found a link to a thread on the Meg's forum showing the proper way to use the product. I was using it the suggusted way but still had nill results on almost every light scratch.

because the only thing you suggusted for me to use was the Scratch X, and not any of the other harsher products that may or may not be used via machine even if using 2 or 3 diffrent products to fix the problems... i can only assume that you were one-sided with use of the Scratch X.

I appoligize if i offended your business practice, even if the DAP is not very effective at removing sanding marks... in my experience using the Scratch X by hand... anything would have to be better.
Note: I do not have a PC yet, so i am not one-sided with the machine... other then your use of Scratch X or with a DAP... what else could be done?

[Mike Phillips]

The accepted an normal way of removing sanding marks is with a rotary buffer.

[Mike Phillips]

Whether or not you can remove a scratch, a multitude of scratches, or swirls depends on a number of different factors, technique being one of them...

Some other factors are paint hardness and the depth of the defect. The deeper the defect, the more paint you have to remove, this is only common sense. And if the paint is hard, like most clear coat finishes are, then it is going to be very difficult to remove small particles of paint in an effort to remove enough to level or flatten out the surface.

The below swirls were instilled most likely with a compound and a wool pad on a rotary buffer, meaning the definitely have some depth to them. Yet, using only ScratchX by hand, we removed them.

Before


After ScratchX, Deep Crystal Polish and one application of NXT Tech Wax Paste

[Mike Phillips]

Often times when people fail to remove a scratch with ScratchX, they also forgot to read the back label. Check out the last paragraph below, which can also be found on the back label of your tube of ScratchX

[Mike Phillips]

Originally posted by integraoligist
because the only thing you suggusted for me to use was the Scratch X, and not any of the other harsher products that may or may not be used via machine even if using 2 or 3 diffrent products to fix the problems... i can only assume that you were one-sided with use of the Scratch X.

I'm not one sided, I was merely trying to help you use the tools you already own, your hands.

[integraoligist]

a rotort buffer used with a polish like your "Diamond Cut"?

**autopia threaded edited for content**

[Mike Phillips]

Watch our how-to video here,

How to remove paint defects

You can also purchase it through Meguiar's in video format for under $10.00

Removing sanding marks with a rotary buffer around touch-up paint is usually considered a tad on the difficult side. If you're serious about using a rotary buffer, then you'll want to practice on something that's not important, such as a junker car, or the hood or deck-lid off a wrecked car. It takes quite a bit of upper body strength and control to remove sanding marks out of small areas like trim with touch-up paint.